Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Sources on MyDD

Is it that hard to come up with good arguments in support of Hillary Clinton?  

If you are going to make an argument here, you have to back it up with a credible source.  If you back it up with a crappy source, or worse, it leads one to conclude you've got nothing to support your argument.    

Here's one Hillary supporter diary, which uses the Drudge Report as the basis of its information.   As a progressive, and someone who believes in real journalism, I think that it is very poor form to ever cite Drudge as source.   Drudge is well known to be a right-wing smear site, which often gets the "scoops" plain wrong (John Edwards Love Child, anyone?), and who biggest journalistic "credit" was over 10 years ago when it "enlightened" the American people about Monica Lewinsky.  

But it gets worse.   Today I went to a smear diary which suggested that Obama's relatives should play some role in our consideration of his suitability for the presidency (and teaches us that being proud of your family members who happen to be Muslim is a big presidential no-no).  One of the particpants in that discussion, to raise an "under-scrutinized" part of Obama's family history, linked a far right wing blog which refers to Obama as "Barack Hussein Obama", and refers to the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. as Marxist Michael King.    

Later, the same commenter linked to a diary by Linda Chavez!!?? on Townhall.com!!???! to support their point.   Linda Chavez was Bush's choice for secretary of Labor who couldn't make it through the Senate confirmation process, which is actually a very good thing because her latest book is titledBetrayal : How Union Bosses Shake Down Their Members and Corrupt American Politics.  But to these Hillary supporters, she is apparently a perfectly credible source to use for a new Obama smear.  

I never imagined that I would, on MyDD.com, have to explain why Drudge, or TownHall.com, or Linda Chavez are not credible sources, or that linking to a site which refers to the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. as Marxist Michael King on Martin Luther King day might not be the best thing to do.   But that is where we are.  

Tags: Hillary Clinton, hillarybots, racist, sources, townhall (all tags)

Comments

23 Comments

Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

I don't know how wide spread this kind of thing is, perhaps (hopefully) these represent some isolated incidents.   Nonetheless, it is troubling.  

by gobacktotexas 2008-01-21 08:12AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

I'll agree with that sentiment.  We don't need to invoke the likes of Drudge and the delightful Linda Chavez to make a point.

Does your condemnation extend to those Obama supporters who defended the odious Robert Novak a couple of months ago?

by Denny Crane 2008-01-21 08:38AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

Absolutely.  Novak is not credible.  

by gobacktotexas 2008-01-21 08:41AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

Very well.  You shall receive mojo.

by Denny Crane 2008-01-21 09:13AM | 0 recs
My diary made no mention of King

(or of Obama's shameful speech in Atlanta yesterday where Obama went into a church used MLK as cover and delivered and overtly political hitjob on John Edwards and Hillary Clinton)

At any rate, I simply pointed out that Obama is mystery to many voters and he himself has not always been helpful in clearing that up.  Whether the issue be small or large, he seems unforthcoming.

Did his half brother Mike go to Berkeley, as Obama claims, or to Standard, as seems may be the case.   Why is it so hard to get such small pieces of information?

There is a power struggles being waged in an important African nation as we sit here today.  The man contesting the elections, and challenging the sitting President, is said to be Obama's uncle.  That would seem to be a very big story ... a Presidential contenders uncle challenging for the leadership of another nation.  

Obama's campaign will not confirm or deny that the man is indeed Obama's uncle.  Again how hard is this, Obama either is or he isn't.

Obama seems to have a pattern of wanting to tell us his lifes story only on his terms, from his perspective and seems to be very leary of letting anyone else get a look and form their own judgements.

I think there is something very fishy about writing about book, saying this is your story, this tells you all about me, but by the way the names and places have been changed.  

You better believe I could write one hell of a book about me if I didn't have to use real names and could change places around.   I'd be the great thing since sliced bread.   You may even want to make me President.   I can always hope right?

But to close, I think facts matter.  Someone baited me asked if I want to talk about Hugh Rodham.   I do.  I want to talk about all the candidates and all the facts, and all the associations positive and negative.

If Obama would be more forth coming, and the media actually covered like a candidate, many of us would not have to be left to google to find facts, and be at risk of coming across certain sites.  

by dpANDREWS 2008-01-21 08:20AM | 0 recs
To Be Fair

There are really only a handful of Hillary Supporters that do stuff like this.  Unfortunately, a very small percentage of the posters on here are making it almost impossible to have a rational dialogue.  

by HSTruman 2008-01-21 08:20AM | 0 recs
We need a media version of 'Joe Friday'

Just give  us the facts.

Who are the candidates, what all their life experineces, who are their relatives, what skeletons may lurk, what positives are there, what good have they done ... give us the facts so we can make decision based on something other than an AM radio or cable tv pundit, who is biased, telling us who these people are.

by dpANDREWS 2008-01-21 08:24AM | 0 recs
Re: We need a media version of 'Joe Friday'

The lesson you seem to have learned from the Bush years is that we should defile our own candidates in the same way that the GOP will.  That's unfortunate, b/c one of the reasons that we're different is that we won't do some things even if they're politicallyl expedient.  That's supposed to be part of being a Democrat.  

by HSTruman 2008-01-21 08:35AM | 0 recs
Facts don't defile

Lies and smears do.  Lies and smears are easier to get away with in the absence of facts.

by dpANDREWS 2008-01-21 08:42AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

Let's be real about a couple things.

First, if linking to Drudge is supposed to be the mark of something sinister, I'm confident there are just as many guilty Obama supporters as Clinton supporters.  It's not worth the time to investigate, but I assure you there is plenty of guilt to go around.

Second, while there were some dubious sources cited in that diary you mention, in reality people basically use Google and include the first link that backs them up.  It might be sloppy, but again, I've seen this from lots of people.  It doesn't mean Clinton supporters are sitting there with a library of Townhall columns to cite to.

by Steve M 2008-01-21 08:26AM | 0 recs
Drudge is usually just a link to a MSM outlet

Any of his own redlight BS I'd take with a grain of salt.

As for Townhall and the rest, they are valuable in one way.  They do give us insight on how the Republicans view our candidates and what their tact will be later.

I would give a hoot whether someone at Townhall trashed one of our candidates econ policy or something like however.

by dpANDREWS 2008-01-21 08:29AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

So you found the diary in question acceptable?

Look, there are certainly Obama supporters who have done and said completely out-of-bounds stuff on this site and elsewhere.  You won't get any argument from me on that score.  But linking to whitesupremacist cites, even inadvertantly, is pretty reprehensible.  I'm not saying that was intentional, but it's telling that that kind of web-sit was running the same story the diarist wanted to tell.  

by HSTruman 2008-01-21 08:34AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

No, I didn't like that diary one bit.  I think I was the first commentor in it, so my opinion isn't exactly a secret.

I actually find it very difficult to figure out what we are supposed to say concerning these issues.  Should it be relevant in the GE that Obama's brother is a Muslim?  Of course not.  Would it be relevant?  Obviously.  Should it be off-limits for us to even discuss?  Probably not.  But what the heck is anyone supposed to say about it?

by Steve M 2008-01-21 08:42AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

Well, that's why this sort of thing is so difficult to respond to.  The diary in question throws this garbage out there under the guise that we need to talk about it because the GOP will bring it up later.  If that's the test, and we can all write "concern" pieces about the crap the GOP is going to do in the future, then the primary process is going to be ridiculously ugly.

For example, should I write a diary about the "rumors" that Bill has been unfaithful since leaving the whitehouse?  Or how about bringing up the "rumor" that the Clintons killed Vince Foster or sold pardons for campaign contributions.  

The GOP will -- of course -- recycle ALL of that rubbish in a General Election but it's still not acceptable for other Democrats to sink to that kind of level.  To me, the diary in question is of the same  order.    

by HSTruman 2008-01-21 09:21AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

I agree with you about that diary, since we know where the diarist stands.  It seems like there ought to be room for people to have genuine discussions about electability problems, but 99% of those discussions seem to be nothing but concern trolling.  Maybe the problem is that so many of us are committed partisans.

by Steve M 2008-01-21 10:03AM | 0 recs
Agreed

I agree with you about genuine debate.  It's only when things go to the absolute extreme that it depresses the heck out of me.  

For better or for worse, I'll be glad when the primary is over.    

by HSTruman 2008-01-21 10:15AM | 0 recs
WHAT!!!

What do you mean John Edwards doesn't have a love child? But, I read it in national enquirer - it must be true!

by AnnC 2008-01-21 08:35AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

God -- this diary would be much  more credible if you didnt just pick out HRC supporters (and the 2 diaries out of the last 20 or so that actually had a bad source).

Anyone can write a diary by cherry picking, but dont attribute to everyone

by sepulvedaj3 2008-01-21 08:57AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

precisely why I said this


I don't know how wide spread this kind of thing is, perhaps (hopefully) these represent some isolated incidents.   Nonetheless, it is troubling.  

When ANYONE links to white supremacist, or right-wing smear sites to support their contentions on MyDD, I do think it deserves to have maximum attention drawn to it, though.  

by gobacktotexas 2008-01-21 09:00AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

I would have to agree.

If you had taken ALL the candidates to task, it wouldn't seem like the back door Clinton hit piece it is.

Even propaganda technique must stay current.

by Marsha1 2008-01-21 09:03AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary Supporters' Use of Questionable Source

I haven't seen Obama supporters linking to White Supremacist sources, nor to townhall.com, to support their arguments.  If you are aware of something I've missed, you are welcome to write your own diary.  

by gobacktotexas 2008-01-21 09:10AM | 0 recs
Fun New Racist Diaries Now Out!!

Ya'll should check out some of the new diaries, which (1) denigrate MLK and the civil rights movement while slamming Obama; and (2) use UTUBE footage as "proof" that Obama sells drugs and has gay sex in limos.  

Wow.  That's all i can say.  Wow.

by HSTruman 2008-01-21 10:36AM | 0 recs
Re: Fun New Racist Diaries Now Out!!

Where the hell are Jerome Armstrong, Todd Beeton, Jonathan Singer, et al?  Doesn't drawing a line somewhere fall within their administrative responsibilities? Or are they content with having this once wonderful site go completely to pot?

by gobacktotexas 2008-01-21 10:57AM | 0 recs

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