On Moderation
by Chris Bowers, Tue Sep 25, 2007 at 10:02:24 AM EDT
So, apparently David Mizner considers being banned from Open Left something to be proud of. He also thinks that I have "translucent skin." It is nice to read an invective against me on the front page of a blog where I still have written far more articles than anyone else, and received way, way more flack than anyone else. Mizner should have seen me cry at the death threats I received during the Googlebomb campaign that I conducted here. My skin really is pretty thin.
For the record, here are the comments that led me to ban Mizner from Open Left. First:
Let me say something straightforward here. One of the reasons that there have been numerous diaries on MyDD complaining about the lack of decorum here is that I am no longer banning people. I used to ban a lot of people when I was on MyDD, and I didn't feel the least bit bad about it. Calling people idiots, implying hidden agendas, attributing positions to people they don't hold and never stated, throwing charges that people are conservative or pro-Bush / occupation in some way without backing it up with quotes--these are all offensive, anti-social actions that can start flame wars on progressives websites. When Mizner engaged in them all on Open Left in one thread, I banned him, just as I banned dozens of people on MyDD for the same offensives during my time editing the blog. I did this in an attempt to reduce the flame wars as much as possible, and make certain that community remained friendly and productive.
In my experience, allowing this type of commentary, especially against front-page posters, results in a less than productive community. I was pretty lenient on bannings here in 2004 and 2005, and the comments were overrun with trolls like Parker as a result. I figured that putting up with irritating commenters was just part of being a blogger. Then, after banning a few of them, I noticed how much the comments and the diaries improved here at MyDD. So, with a new warning system in place, I began to moderate the site in a pretty strict fashion. About six months ago, I wrote a front-page piece explaining some of the many things that could lead to being banned, which is all on top of the anti-social, baiting behavior I documented above from Mizner. I tried to read every comment on the site, and follow every argument, to make sure that no one engaging in these behaviors was not first warned, and then banned if the problems continued.
Of course, MyDD is no longer my main blog home. It is not my job to moderate the community around here (although I do sometimes still go to old posts can clean out the spam robots). Jerome, Jonathan and Todd can moderate this community as they choose. I am writing this in the diaries, instead of on the front page, for that reason. However, given Mizner's latest front-page post personally attacking me on a blog that I helped build from 800,000 visitors to 28,000,000 over the course of more than three years was far too much for me to keep quiet. It also struck me as a perfect example of what many commenters are complaining about here on MyDD. Seriously, after all I have done for this site and this community, now I'm getting attacked on the front-page here? I guess no one deserves any respect here, if they cross that terrible line of not endorsing your favorite candidate.
I am upfront about have a heavy moderation style, and a quick finger when it comes to banning. Long experience with flame wars and moderation have convinced me it is better to err on the side of banning too many people than banning too few. Letting people feel insulted and pissed off by the comments on your site is a terrible way to buld a community. As such, I am acting at Open Left the same way I would have acted at MyDD, and I find nothing more tiresome than the claims about free speech and openness. Blog are not open message boards, and if they are treated as such the comments will invariably descend into utterly useless flame wars. If you hope to build an activist site, that simply is not acceptable. Maybe we should turn the DNC convention into an open forum with no moderation and a mad scramble for the podium. I'm sure that will turn out well.
Just my two cents. I wrote 3,100 articles for MyDD, presided over about 95% of the all-time traffic, links and new account sign-ups here. It still bears my name, and will always be a major part of my life. Maybe it is just because I have translucent skin, but being attacked on the front page here as part of a seemingly endless argument over 2008 candidates was extremely disappointing, and I hope is not a sign of things to come for the blog.
Update: If anyone thinks Mizner was acting in good faith, consider that what he said to me is exactly the same thing he has said about all bloggers who have not endorsed in the past. Here is one such comment:
For the record, here are the comments that led me to ban Mizner from Open Left. First:
It's pretty amusing that you've put yourself in the positon of defending the occuption of Iraq.Ah, I love comments like that. Nothing makes me feel better than to be told how pro-Iraq occupation I am after spending several months leading the charge online against residual forces in Iraq. Second:
Let me say...this...slowly..so..you...understan d.I also enjoy being called an idiot.
I find weaknesses of logic and coherence, just I found weakness in Stoller's claim that Edwards is racist, and weakness in your condoning (now immediately retracted) the occupation of Iraq.I particularly enjoy having positions attributed to me that I never supported, ever. More:
And unlike you, Chris, I don't care if Peter Daou gives me a mean look at Yearly KosThis is another example of Mizner finding more logical holes in my arguments, I guess.
Let me say something straightforward here. One of the reasons that there have been numerous diaries on MyDD complaining about the lack of decorum here is that I am no longer banning people. I used to ban a lot of people when I was on MyDD, and I didn't feel the least bit bad about it. Calling people idiots, implying hidden agendas, attributing positions to people they don't hold and never stated, throwing charges that people are conservative or pro-Bush / occupation in some way without backing it up with quotes--these are all offensive, anti-social actions that can start flame wars on progressives websites. When Mizner engaged in them all on Open Left in one thread, I banned him, just as I banned dozens of people on MyDD for the same offensives during my time editing the blog. I did this in an attempt to reduce the flame wars as much as possible, and make certain that community remained friendly and productive.
In my experience, allowing this type of commentary, especially against front-page posters, results in a less than productive community. I was pretty lenient on bannings here in 2004 and 2005, and the comments were overrun with trolls like Parker as a result. I figured that putting up with irritating commenters was just part of being a blogger. Then, after banning a few of them, I noticed how much the comments and the diaries improved here at MyDD. So, with a new warning system in place, I began to moderate the site in a pretty strict fashion. About six months ago, I wrote a front-page piece explaining some of the many things that could lead to being banned, which is all on top of the anti-social, baiting behavior I documented above from Mizner. I tried to read every comment on the site, and follow every argument, to make sure that no one engaging in these behaviors was not first warned, and then banned if the problems continued.
Of course, MyDD is no longer my main blog home. It is not my job to moderate the community around here (although I do sometimes still go to old posts can clean out the spam robots). Jerome, Jonathan and Todd can moderate this community as they choose. I am writing this in the diaries, instead of on the front page, for that reason. However, given Mizner's latest front-page post personally attacking me on a blog that I helped build from 800,000 visitors to 28,000,000 over the course of more than three years was far too much for me to keep quiet. It also struck me as a perfect example of what many commenters are complaining about here on MyDD. Seriously, after all I have done for this site and this community, now I'm getting attacked on the front-page here? I guess no one deserves any respect here, if they cross that terrible line of not endorsing your favorite candidate.
I am upfront about have a heavy moderation style, and a quick finger when it comes to banning. Long experience with flame wars and moderation have convinced me it is better to err on the side of banning too many people than banning too few. Letting people feel insulted and pissed off by the comments on your site is a terrible way to buld a community. As such, I am acting at Open Left the same way I would have acted at MyDD, and I find nothing more tiresome than the claims about free speech and openness. Blog are not open message boards, and if they are treated as such the comments will invariably descend into utterly useless flame wars. If you hope to build an activist site, that simply is not acceptable. Maybe we should turn the DNC convention into an open forum with no moderation and a mad scramble for the podium. I'm sure that will turn out well.
Just my two cents. I wrote 3,100 articles for MyDD, presided over about 95% of the all-time traffic, links and new account sign-ups here. It still bears my name, and will always be a major part of my life. Maybe it is just because I have translucent skin, but being attacked on the front page here as part of a seemingly endless argument over 2008 candidates was extremely disappointing, and I hope is not a sign of things to come for the blog.
Update: If anyone thinks Mizner was acting in good faith, consider that what he said to me is exactly the same thing he has said about all bloggers who have not endorsed in the past. Here is one such comment:
The fence-sitting of the bloggerati smells to me like a fear of losing traffic.And here is another one:
And if you're not doing something for fear of straining your relationships with people in power, friends or not, it's time to reevaluate your priorities.Mizner has a history of accusing those with whom he disagrees of having hidden agendas. He isn't acting in good faith. And yes, people like that should be banned.
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myDD - skin
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