How Can Anyone In The Blogosphere Advocate For The DLC Candidate?

by Cheebs, Sun Mar 23, 2008 at 02:06:11 PM EDT

This is something that confuses me greatly. Wasn't MyDD about crashing the gate? Advocating the Dean strategy and pushing for progressive ideals and pushing back against the moderation of the DLC?

Before 2008 MyDD had nothing but hatred distaste for the DLC, much like nearly all of the left-leaning blogosphere.

How can there be such a sudden shift on this very blog to pushing strongly for the DLC candidate, one who is one of the top 3 DLC leaders and picture is on the front page of the DLC website.

The DLC stood for everything that MyDD stood against as recently as just last year. How could so many on MyDD fall into line with the DLC?

It confuses me.

Tags: clinton, DLC (all tags)

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Re: How Can Anyone In The Blogosphere Advocate For

Maybe its because the candidate most associated with the DLC is up 1 million votes among registered democrats

I am a moderate Democrat, we are the majority.

That you would try and silence a fellow Democratic wing is poor form on your behalf.

by DTaylor 2008-03-23 02:08PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone In The Blogosphere Advocate For

MyDD was not a place to advocate the ideals of "Reagan Democrats" and the DLC though. Read Crashing the Gate, written by Jerome.

by Cheebs 2008-03-23 02:11PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone In The Blogosphere Advocate For

So censorship within the Democratic party is what you are selling?

If you don't like DLC and want to talk about why thats fair

But trying to pull the plug on the other sides mic is more dailykos than mydd I think.

by DTaylor 2008-03-23 02:16PM | 0 recs

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Equal Time! On Markos and the DLC...

Since we're discussing the relationship of the DLC to the blogging community, I thought it was appropriate to bring everyone's attention to this tidbit, currently contained within Markos' biography on his Wiki page:

Moulitsas is a fellow at the New Politics Institute, a think tank of the New Democrat Network, founded by Simon Rosenberg in 1996. The NDN's stated purpose is to help elect "centrist" Democrats, and is considered by many to be a successor to the centrist Democratic Leadership Council (DLC), an organization that Simon Rosenberg resigned from in 1996.

by bobswern 2008-03-23 03:17PM | 0 recs

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The Dean Fraud

Maybe that was before the Dean strategy of pushing for "progressive ideals" included the suppression of the primary vote in Florida and Michigan.

by pollbuster 2008-03-23 02:19PM | 0 recs

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Re: The Dean Fraud

Maybe that was before the Dean strategy of pushing for "progressive ideals" included the suppression of the primary vote in Florida and Michigan.

I think you're forgetting two of his accomplices: Harold Ickes and Hillary Clinton.

by RP McMurphy 2008-03-23 02:34PM | 0 recs

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Re: The Dean Fraud

Maybe that was before the Dean strategy of pushing for "progressive ideals" included the suppression of the primary vote in Florida and Michigan.

I think you're forgetting two of his accomplices: Harold Ickes and Hillary Clinton.

He's the leader of the DNC, but why should he take responsibility for his own actions, when he has people like you ready to blame others. If that's what you really think embodies progressivism, then I feel truly sorry for you.

by pollbuster 2008-03-23 03:00PM | 0 recs

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Re: The Dean Fraud

He's the leader of the DNC, but why should he take responsibility for his own actions, when he has people like you ready to blame others.

Because his leadership of the DNC is hardly a dictatorship. A committee drafted the rules for the 2008 primary election. Florida and Michigan were represented on that committee. Later, Florida and Michigan decided to break that agreement. Another committee, one that Harold Ickes sat on, decided to strip both states of their delegates as a punishment. All the presidential campaigns agreed to abide by the ruling. So as you can see, this is hardly the fault of one individual. Primarily, it's the fault of Florida and Michigan.

If that's what you really think embodies progressivism, then I feel truly sorry for you.

Well, I don't consider myself "progressive" -- I'm more of a "liberal." And if progressivism means barely-veiled opportunism and unthinking knee-jerk reaction based purely on the fortunes of the candidate one is supporting, then count me out.

by RP McMurphy 2008-03-23 03:14PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone In The Blogosphere Advocate For

I am a moderate Democrat that fund raised for Bill in 1992, and even joined the Army under his watch. I thought the DLC was a great way to bridge the partisan divide back then . . . and it may still have some hope of doing that.

Unfortunately HRC's handlers ran a very poor campaign in the early months, and have created a divide that not many saw coming.

I wasn't on MyDD when they crafted their mission statement, but there is one thing that all Democrats should agree on (whether they are blue-dogs, DLCers, or far left) . . . and that is to keep a majority in Congress, hold on the Supreme Court, and keep the GOP out of the White House.

I prefer the 50-state strategy, and I love the enthusiasm that Obama will bring down-ticket. I also don't drink Kool-Aid from either side.

THINK BIG PICTURE! WE WILL KUMBAYA by July.

by Veteran75 2008-03-23 02:28PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone In The Blogosphere Advocate For

Maybe its because the candidate most associated with the DLC is up 1 million votes among registered democrats

Really? And where do you come up with those numbers? Moreover, just because someone isn't a "registered" Democrat doesn't mean they aren't a Democrat. And it's not as if you'd like this thing to be decided by the most committed and active members of the party -- we know you folks don't like caucuses. But open primaries are unacceptable as well, huh? Short of giving Hillary Clinton the nomination, I just don't think we can please some of you "Goldilocks."

I am a moderate Democrat, we are the majority.

I'm moderate too, but I don't consider voting for the War or the Bankruptcy Bill or the Flag-burning amendment "moderate." I consider it selling-out --
exactly what the DLC does best.

That you would try and silence a fellow Democratic wing is poor form on your behalf.

The diarist wasn't suggesting silencing anyone -- he/she is simply suggesting that Jerome and MyDD have betrayed their supposed ideals in supporting the DLC candidate.

by RP McMurphy 2008-03-23 02:33PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone

I like Obama, but i support Hillary. I'm very liberal.

I support her because she supports UHC, because i think she's ready to be commander-in-chief, because she's the best qualified to put the economy back on track, because she's spent her life fighting for womens' and childrens' rights...

Obama is apparently so magical that he's the obvious choice if you're progressive, moderate or conservative.

by liberalj 2008-03-23 03:19PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone

Obama is apparently so magical that he's the obvious choice if you're progressive, moderate or conservative.

I don't think anyone's suggested that. As far as the exit polls are concerned, Obama paradoxically tends to win both liberal and conservative Democrats whereas Hillary carries moderates.

by RP McMurphy 2008-03-23 03:31PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone

Is Obama really winning conservative Democrats?

Isn't one of the big worries about Obama that he can't carry Reagan Democrats?

by liberalj 2008-03-23 03:38PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone

Is Obama really winning conservative Democrats?

Yes.

by RP McMurphy 2008-03-23 05:39PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone

OK i'm convinced. Your yes is all i need...

If Obama was carrying conservative Democrats then he'd of won in Oklahoma and Tennessee. He would of won rural Ohio.

I just don't see the evidence that Obama is carrying conservative democrats, if you have some then i'd like to see it.

by liberalj 2008-03-23 06:35PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone

I just don't see the evidence that Obama is carrying conservative democrats, if you have some then i'd like to see it.

Check the CNN exit polls (all of them show more or less the same thing). Let's take Ohio, for instance. Hillary won a pretty big victory, so you'd expect her to carry nearly every ideological demographic. However, among conservative Democrats, she tied Obama at 48-48%. Among moderates, she faired best (56-42%), and among liberals he did a little better (53-46%). So, had the election been decided by self-professed conservative Democrats in Ohio, Clinton and Obama would've essentially tied.

by RP McMurphy 2008-03-24 12:22AM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone

Since when does a tie equal an Obama win?

by liberalj 2008-03-24 04:42AM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone

Since when does a tie equal an Obama win?

The point we were discussing concerned which demographics each candidate was winning. I made the point that Obama tends to do best among conservatives and liberals whereas Hillary tends to win moderates. Now, the point isn't that Hillary and Obama tied among conservatives in Ohio, it's that Hillary won a large victory in Ohio but still only managed to tie Obama among conservatives -- her worst ideological demographic. It's not the case that Obama outright wins self-described liberals and conservatives in EVERY state, it's just the case that he does best, overall, among these two ideological demographics.

by RP McMurphy 2008-03-24 05:45AM | 0 recs

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Re: Do you know how MANY DLC

Cheebs,

Do you know how many DLC'ers have endorsed your candidate Barack Obama in this 2008 Primary?

I have not heard Obama disavow those endorsements!
He's actually embraced them.

Nelson on NE, McCaskill of MO , Napolitano of AZ,
Richardson of NM, Sebelius of KS ? Should I go on?

I don't here any liberal Obama fans whining about All the VERY KEY DLC supporters who have endorsed him?

And say what ? Hillary is supposed to be the DLC?

Stop whining about DLC when your very own candidate is very much accepting all their support.

This is the HYPOCRISY from SEVERAL MAJOR Netroots Leaders who have consistently ATTACK the DLC.

Now that they happen to support Obama & he is getting the same DEVIL DLC members, these netroots leaders keeping MUM & SILENT.

Its HYPOCRISY! IF Hillary was endorsed by All these Red state DLC members, these same Netroots Bigwigs would be attacking them. But since they endorsed Obama, the got a Free pass.

by libdemusa 2008-03-23 03:34PM | 0 recs

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Re: Do you know how MANY DLC

And say what ? Hillary is supposed to be the DLC?

Hillary is a member of the DLC Leadership Team. If you go to their website, she's pictured along with Harold Ford, Tom Carper, and Al From. Obama is not now nor has ever been a member of the DLC. That's the difference. I could care less about their respective supporters.

by RP McMurphy 2008-03-23 03:59PM | 0 recs

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Re: Do you know how MANY DLC

We aren't voting for supporters. Hillary is in the DLC, Obama isn't.

Back in the late 90's when Obama was seen as a rising star in the state senate and many predicted would break into national politics his name was put on a DLC pamplet that listed rising stars in the DLC.

What did Obama do? He DEMANDED his name be taken off, that he would not join the DLC.

That shows his opposition to the DLC.

by Cheebs 2008-03-23 04:55PM | 0 recs

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I love the need of Obamacans to reinvent

history. Obama was not some "rising star" in the late 90s in IL. Obama's whole career was made in one year in '03 when Emil Jones gave him legislation to put his name on.

by LatinoVoter 2008-03-23 08:59PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone In The Blogosphere Advocate For

look, i'm not happy about obama attacking universal healthcare from the right, and hanging out with those chicago economists who want to privatize social security. but the way i see it is people are free to support any candidate they want.

just because obama is taking the centrist approach and cozying up to republicans doesn't make him all bad. he appeals to people who won't be depending on their social security for a big chunk of their retirement income, and who can afford healthcare. it's just the poor people who don't like his positions.

calling him DLC just because he takes centrist and right positions on social issues is unfair to him, in my opinion.

by campskunk 2008-03-23 05:03PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone In The Blogosphere Advocate For

look, i'm not happy about obama attacking universal healthcare from the right,

I think it's pretty obvious that Republicans would use the fear of mandates to kill any healthcare plan that contained them. It would be another example of Senator Clinton botching healthcare because she refused to accept reality and navigate the legislative process effectively. But I think she's smarter than that. I think she knows that mandates are DOA in the Senate and is only proposing the idea as a starting point and a place from which to attack Senator Obama.

and hanging out with those chicago economists who want to privatize social security.

Social security can probably be salvaged. Medicare is a looming problem, and a huge one at that. It's simply not possible to redistribute so much of a nation's wealth from the productive to the idle without incurring a huge economic cost. I'm not sure to what degree Obama is committed to solving our entitlement problem, but it's encouraging to note that his advisers at least recognize it.

just because obama is taking the centrist approach and cozying up to republicans doesn't make him all bad.

I can't figure this out. Some days, Obama's too liberal to win. Other days, he's too much of a centrist. Which is it? And had Hillary Clinton done a little less cozying to up the Republicans on Iraq, the Bankruptcy Bill, the Flag-burning amendment, the Workplace Religious Freedom Act, Kyl-Lieberman, etc. I might be more inclined to support her.

it's just the poor people who don't like his positions.

Poor people don't know his positions. In fact, the majority of poor people know very little about politics. I know this will anger a lot of folks, but that's a demonstrable fact. Income, education, and one's level of current events/political knowledge are strongly correlated. Poor people tend to vote for Hillary because they're uniformed.

by RP McMurphy 2008-03-23 05:53PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone In The Blogosphere Advocate For

I think it's pretty obvious that Republicans would use the fear of mandates to kill any healthcare plan that contained them.

Obama has mandates in his plan, too, you know.

by sricki 2008-03-23 06:54PM | 0 recs

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Foar...

Obama has mandates in his plan, too, you know.

... Teh Children!

Will Someone Please Think of The Children?!

I reckon that can be sold.

by kraant 2008-03-23 07:55PM | 0 recs

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Re: Foar...

... Teh Children!

Will Someone Please Think of The Children?!

I reckon that can be sold.

BINGO

by RP McMurphy 2008-03-23 08:01PM | 0 recs

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Re: Foar...

Heh, all foar teh childrenz, indeed! In some ways, it's an easier argument to make. However, Hillary's point -- that mandates for children are problematic when the parents don't have to buy healthcare for themselves -- is valid, and the Repulicans will recognize it, too. What if the parents get sick and lose their jobs? They still have to buy healthcare for their children (even the ones who are 16 or 17 and no longer in school or even necessarily living at home)? The GOP will fight healthcare reform tooth and nail, and Obama's more lenient plan won't stop them. A "mandate for children" is still a mandate on a vast number of Americans. We've got a lot of parents in this country. Besides, "mandate" in any sense just translates to "big government" for Republians. It's the idea that people will be forced to buy it that bothers them. We'll see all those B.S. arguments like, "Parents should be able to make their own choices in how they rear their children." (Blah blah blah...)

by sricki 2008-03-23 08:12PM | 0 recs

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Re: How Can Anyone In The Blogosphere Advocate For

Maybe because we're realistic about how change happens. Hilary supporters are in the tradition of the first 2 term Democratic president since FDR. Not in the traditional of all the noble losers, the Kerry's, Dasheles, Teddy's. Not the would-a should-a could-a.

Changing the status quo is only going to happen from the middle and HRC and DLC and we are more moderate.

If you're a true progressive, why not write in Nader? Just think, he got 90,000 FL votes in 00, and Bush won FL, and the election, by 570. But it was a noble cause...

by NY Writer 2008-03-23 08:07PM | 0 recs

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If the DLC is so bad then why

does Obama have Goolsby on his team?

by LatinoVoter 2008-03-23 09:01PM | 0 recs