must get to oxygen tank.  brain hurt.

Hey Todd: It seems to me that there is a deterrent to states doing this the next time. Even though the MI and FL delegations get their full voting rights at the convention, these states totally blew their chance to be relevant in actually selecting the Democratic nominee and that should be enough deterrent I would think. I mean think about it, if both MI and FL had just stayed where they were at in the original primary calendar they each would have had a huge, if not decisive, roll in picking the nominee rather than being just an afterthought rubberstamp.

What a huge mistake.  Now we are going to have absolute chaos in 2012, and Carl Levin will guarantee it.  We will probably start having primaries in November of 2011 now.   This is getting rediculous
You want to talk about Oil Problems.  Carl Levin is the #1 person to blame.  He continues to thwart any effort to increase fuel efficeincy.  We wikll never get oil independent as long as Carl Levin is in Washington.

"Which means there's really no deterrent to states' doing the same thing in subsequent years"

You need to think deeper than superficialities. FL and MI tried to have an impact on the process greater than they would have had under the existing rules. As a result they were punished and had no impact on the process. In the future politicians will think more than twice before risking the same fate for their states.

I predicted  at the time FL and MI were sanctioned (probably along with many others) that in the end they would be seated in order to foster goodwill. And thanks to Obama's good judgment that is what has happened.

But some folks have to find a way to piss on anything he does.

Both Obama and Clinton long ago made separate agreements that they were going to do this.  If anyone had a problem with it, they should have taken it up then (wow, I just realized how much that resembled the original debate over Florida and Michigan, only now it's the other way around.)

But seriously.   When Barack Obama said that if he became the nominee, he would restore the delegations of both states, I don't recall hearing anyone think it was a bad idea.

At any rate, I didn't.  Neither state was able to influence the outcome this year - isn't that deterrent enough?  

Or did the states get what the appropriate penalty was: losing their relevance.

I feel bad, though, for the average citizens. They paid for politician greed.

I still think the penalty should have been for the penalty states to lose all their superdelegates.

They were punished - their effect on the primary was drastically reduced, and received far less attention/campaign expenditures.  The idea that this was not a deterrent is factually wrong.

The solution is simple.  Punish sates for political opportunism and stupidity.

All primaries and caucus before the firts Tuesday in February have their delegate totals reduced by 50%.  You get a 200% bump in delegates for having a primary/caucus after March 15 and you get a 400% bump in delegates for doing so after May 1.

I did not mind MI wanting to move its primary although I think Florida got skunked by a GOP run Legislature and statehouse.  If Michigan issues are so important --- think about the cost of being first ---- why screw yourself out of being counted until after the race is over.

after the contest was decided.  They had no delegates when it actually mattered, and if the convention were contested, you can bet they would only get what the DNC RBC said they'd get.

Carl Levin can crow all he wants, but the simple fact is unchanged: nobody campaigned there and the state had no relevance in helping to select a nominee.

Neither state got the benefit of the candidates actually campaigning there, nor saw any ads.  The states were ignored in favor of the GOP contests those days, and the news stations did not even bother to count their delegates.

I think everyone learned their lesson.