Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out For Leverage?

Just posted, from the AP wire (via Smith):

The former first lady will stop short of formally suspending or ending her race in her speech in New York City. Obama is 40 delegates shy of clinching the nomination, but he is widely expected to make up the difference Tuesday with superdelegate support and votes in South Dakota and Montana. Once he reaches the magic number of 2,118, Clinton will acknowledge that he has secured the necessary delegates to be the nominee.

She will pledge to continue to speak out on issues like health care. But for all intents and purposes, the two senior officials said, the campaign is over.

Most campaign staff will be let go and will be paid through June 15, said the officials who spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to divulge her plans.

The advisers said Clinton has made a strategic decision to not formally end her campaign, giving her leverage to negotiate with Obama on various matters including a possible vice presidential nomination for her. She also wants to press him on issues he should focus on in the fall, such as health care.

I see on a couple blogs, however, that Wolfson is already denying the report.

I will be covering Clinton's victory speechconcession event tonight in NYC - should be interesting to see how she walks this tightrope.

Update [2008-6-3 11:45:19 by Josh Orton]: Not so fast? The Clinton campaign, via email: "The AP story is incorrect. Senator Clinton will not concede the nomination this evening."

I'm starting to get dizzy.

Tags: Barack Obama, Election 08, Hillary Clinton (all tags)

Comments

179 Comments

Wow its over

hard to beleive.

by parahammer 2008-06-03 07:36AM | 0 recs
The Clinton Campaign Has Denied

this ENTIRE AP story already. Harold Ickes was on MSNBC. Can't type fast enough to keep up this morning!!!

by RNinNC 2008-06-03 07:40AM | 0 recs
Re: The Clinton Campaign Has Denied

It's still over.

by parahammer 2008-06-03 07:41AM | 0 recs
Think it through

Whether it was true or false, they would deny it.  Hillary Clinton, if she concedes, is going to be the one to do it and until she does, it's her campaign's job to say that she's in this all the way to the convention.

by Jess81 2008-06-03 07:43AM | 0 recs
Oh, I Know...

I'm pro-Obama, but was confused by reports of Clinton dropping out as the polls opened on the final two Primaries. Didn't make sense. I want it to end, but agree it should be on her terms. Maybe AP was just stealing her thunder, so they took it back.

Who knows - like I've said, no one can type fast enough to keep up with the news this morning!

by RNinNC 2008-06-03 07:47AM | 0 recs
timing and the statement

Actually, Ickes said ""We don't think either one will have the nomination by tonight. Mrs. Clinton continues to make her case to the uncommitted superdelegates that will decide this."

But keep in mind that Clinton's event starts BEFORE THE POLLS CLOSE IN SD AND MT. Her event starts at 7PM eastern, while Obama's is hours later.

So by the time Clinton speaks, he probably won't have the delegates. He'll have them later on.

by politicsmatters 2008-06-03 07:52AM | 0 recs
Re: timing and the statement

St. Paul Mayor Chris Coleman, a staunch backer of Sen. Hillary Clinton, said Monday he's preparing to endorse her opponent, Sen. Barack Obama, for president when Obama takes the stage at the Xcel Energy Center tonight.

"I'm going to certainly attend as the mayor of St. Paul hosting the presumptive nominee," Coleman, a member of Clinton's Minnesota steering committee, told the Pioneer Press. "I certainly expect to endorse Barack tomorrow night after all the votes are counted. The outcome will be clear. Out of respect for Senator Clinton, I'm going to give her a chance to make her statement, but ...." He didn't complete the thought.
http://www.twincities.com/ci_9459343?IAD ID=Search-www.twincities.com-www.twincit ies.com

by politicsmatters 2008-06-03 07:54AM | 0 recs
As usual, very carefully parsed

So Hillary will preempt the will of the people, speak before the polls close, and deny her "every vote counts" message to claim that neither candidate has enough votes to win?

How cleverly convenient.

Meanwhile, Camp Clinton is once again internally squabbling with their he-said, she-said mixed messages.  Hmmmmm.

Hasn't this been her problem since back in February when Wolfson and Penn were publicly arguing with each other over who was most responsible for the loss?

I'm sure we will hear shortly from some expert who has "proof" that all this confusion is some mysterious Obama plot because Bill has assured us that Obama controls AP.

by Eman 2008-06-03 09:04AM | 0 recs
Re: Wow its over

I salute Hillary Clinton and her supporters.

She used to be my preferred candidate and I certainly had plenty to say on her behalf when I made my case to others.

It's been a hard fought race.  

by politicsmatters 2008-06-03 07:55AM | 0 recs
No VP slot.

The fact that her support for the nominee appears to be conditional should be the 999th sign she's unfit to replace Obama if anything happens to him.

by Firewall 2008-06-03 07:36AM | 0 recs
Re: she's unfit to replace Obama

Obama supporters just never tire of eviscerating Hillary, do they. Well, without an Obama/Hillary '08 unity ticket, I'll be writing in my vote for Hillary as president. Factor that into your oh so superior logic.

by phoenixdreamz 2008-06-03 07:42AM | 0 recs
Re: she's unfit to replace Obama

Then you'll only have yourself and others like you to blame should McCain end up President.

And you'll only have yourself to blame when McCain implements everything anathema to what you believe Hillary stands for.

by Yalin 2008-06-03 07:46AM | 0 recs
Sorry, no

The message has been loud and clear for a very long time now - we don't want Hillary or her supporters. A unity ticket would convince me Obama is serious about what he says, despite what has happened.

by phoenixdreamz 2008-06-03 08:01AM | 0 recs
Re: Sorry, no

Do whatever you want.  We will do our best to win this thing without you.

by Blue Neponset 2008-06-03 08:12AM | 0 recs
Re: Sorry, no

Maybe not so much Hillary, but the supporters are certainly welcome.

by Yalin 2008-06-03 08:19AM | 0 recs
Re: Sorry, no

You are no Obama supporter..

This one's for you phoenix..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5WbyUZFE MM

by nogo postal 2008-06-03 08:31AM | 0 recs
Re: Sorry, no

No - the message is that we're not going to be threatened and badgered into accepting some sort of asterisk.

I have plenty of regard for Hillary Clinton - I said all through the 90s that she was my favorite Clinton.  

I have plenty of regard for most of her supporters.  Many of my friends slot into that category.

What I - and I think most Obama supporters - simply will NOT accept is this idea of a half win... or a tainted win... or an asterisked win.

It's insulting and infuriating.

Hillary Clinton came into this race with every possible sort of advantage.

She had near universal name recognition.  She had more money.  She had all the institutional support in the world.  She had a beloved two term President stumping for her - a rarity in the history of ANY party nominating contest.

Barack Obama and his many supporters worked their/our asses off to pull off this longshot win.

I'll not have it diminished by sour grapes.

Would I be OK with Hillary on the ticket?

Sure.  It wouldn't personally affect my vote or my support one little bit.   I don't personally think it helps Obama in the General, but that's a personal analysis no different than that of any of the others thousands of armchair analysts in the blogoshpere.

What I will NOT be OK with is accepting HRC as VP by the point of bayonet.

by zonk 2008-06-03 08:41AM | 0 recs
Held Hostage

I believe "Held Hostage" is the best term to describe the following behavior, if in fact it is true:

"The advisers said Clinton has made a strategic decision to not formally end her campaign, giving her leverage to negotiate with Obama on various matters including a possible vice presidential nomination for her."

by Eman 2008-06-03 09:08AM | 0 recs
No, we'll be blaming

the person who deserves the blame - Obama.  

by Montague 2008-06-03 01:37PM | 0 recs
Re: No, we'll be blaming

If people like you or phoenixdreams or whoever else supporting Hillary Clinton and her causes doesn't support Obama and he loses because enough of you did not, then it is certainly the fault of those people who didn't go out and vote for him.

And those people will have to live with the consequences of a McCain presidency. More dead americans, a conservative supreme court for a generation, etc.

by Yalin 2008-06-03 09:48PM | 0 recs
OMG get over it

If McCain is president and there are more dead Americans and a conservative SCOTUS (oh, wait, we already have a conservative SCOTUS, but never mind), I'll know whose fault it is: the guy with such a huge ego that he destroyed the one candidate who could win the WH - Hillary Clinton.  The egotist who has done his best to hound her out of the race when she has more votes.  

That's right, I will be forced to live under a McCain presidency because of the hubris of Obama and the foolishness of his supporters, such as yourself.  I realize that Obama, much like Bush, doesn't enjoy taking responsibility for the consequences of his actions, or even responsibility for his votes or his words.  That does not absolve him of responsibility, nonetheless.

Live with it.  It's coming.  And it's thanks to you.

by Montague 2008-06-27 07:27PM | 0 recs
Obamaphiles are getting dizzy?

Yup, lies will do that to you.

by CoyoteCreek 2008-06-03 07:48AM | 0 recs
There are cranks in every election.

"I'll be writing in my vote for Hillary as president."

by Freespeechzone 2008-06-03 07:54AM | 0 recs
Re: There are cranks in every election.

Let's hope Obama has better diplomacy skills than his supporters. And let's hope he actually means what he says since clearly his supporters don't take what he says seriously.

by Juno 2008-06-03 08:07AM | 0 recs
Re: There are cranks in every election.
both sides need to move towards each other. it's not an either/or type of thing. both sides need to drop some attitude, too!
=)
by Metrobot 2008-06-03 08:31AM | 0 recs
Re: There are cranks in every election.

Considering he's an enormously successful politician, I'd say that's a given.

by Covin 2008-06-03 08:39AM | 0 recs
It swings both ways

Clinton supporters don't have a monopoly on feeling disrespected.

As I said above - Hillary Clinton came into this nominating contest with every conceivable advantage... name ID, money, institutional support, you name it.

I remember way back in early January, after New Hampshire -- talking with some other Obama backing friends.  We weren't drinking any kool-aid - we knew the odds were long.  The consensus was that our chances of pulling this off were no better than 1 in 4.

But we worked our asses off - just like millions of other Obama supporters.

I have plenty of respect for HIllary Clinton.  I have plenty of respect for many of her supporters.

But - what I absolutely, positively, will NOT accept, under any circumstances - is that this win is 'tainted', or asterisked, or some sort of pseudo-half win.

We won this thing fair and square, with hours of hard work and effort.

That doesn't diminish the effort and time of Clinton or her supporters.

I'm all for respect and unity - but it has to be a two-way street.

by zonk 2008-06-03 08:47AM | 0 recs
Re: she's unfit to replace Obama

I think this election is about more than a referendum on either candidate.  Both candidates have said as much themselves.  Given what's at stake, I would enthusiastically support either candidate if they put a cocker-spaniel in the VP slot on the ticket.

And yes, I'd prefer a cocker-spaniel to McCain in the Oval Office if something happened to them.

But of course, it's your vote.  You can do with it as you please.  I'd fight a war to preserve your right to do so.  Even if that means being tiresomely threatened with its utter and irresponsible waste.

by Strummerson 2008-06-03 07:58AM | 0 recs
Re:

"tiresomely threatened with its utter and irresponsible waste"

The audacity of hope has been replaced with the arrogance of cynicism.

Way to convince Hillary supporters you care about more than their vote - NOT.

by phoenixdreamz 2008-06-03 08:05AM | 0 recs
Re:

Care to explain how this is either arrogant or cynical?  

We are discussing responses to the hypothetical situation of Obama being nominated and choosing someone beside HRC for VP.  In that situation, writing in Clinton's name, given what is at stake in this election would constitute, in my opinion, an utter and irresponsible waste of a vote.  Threats to do so have become tiresome.  

Where in this do you see cynicism or arrogance?

by Strummerson 2008-06-03 08:10AM | 0 recs
Re:

Strummerson isn't Barack Obama, last time I checked. Now it's Obama's fault when his supporters are cynical... just like it's his fault when Jeremiah Wright says some crazy shit, or it's Hillary's fault when Bill Clinton goes on a ridiculous tirade?

by Covin 2008-06-03 08:43AM | 0 recs
Re: she's unfit to replace Obama

Ill factor the fact is the most asinine thing to do.   Oh damn John Edwards my pick didnt make it if hes not VP im writing him in so John McCain can win. If everyones first candidate didnt make it we would never get a Democrat into the White House. Howard Dean anyone?

whatever. . .  I love how people basically are trying to blackmail the Obama campaign. Thats just stupid.

by John a Va Dem 2008-06-03 08:07AM | 0 recs
Re: she's unfit to replace Obama

Oh, I'm a stupid blackmailer now too huh.

Look in the mirror. You simply can't help yourselves. You are agressively, compulsively abusive toward anything and everything that dosen't suit your agenda. Where I come from, that's how Republicans act, not Democrats.

Things have "changed" alright.

by phoenixdreamz 2008-06-03 08:18AM | 0 recs
Re: she's unfit to replace Obama

Well honestly, I don't see Biden supporters saying "If Obama doesn't offer the VP position to Biden, I'll be writing him in". I don't see Edwards supporters saying that. I don't see Dodd or Richardson supporters saying it.

Only one candidate's fans seem so entitled.

by Aris Katsaris 2008-06-03 08:22AM | 0 recs
Re: she's unfit to replace Obama

You act as if Clinton supporters haven't been getting what they've asked for. "You all" have trashed our candidate as much as "we" have trashed yours. Your choice to ignore this fact is what is earning you the criticism you keep complaining about. And the same goes for me and any others who have made foolish comments about our candidates--and their supporters.

by Covin 2008-06-03 08:49AM | 0 recs
Re: she's unfit to replace Obama

No one's going to grovel for your support: your vote is yours and yours alone. I honestly could not care less who 200 childish, dead-ender blog commenters choose to vote for.

by authority song 2008-06-03 08:42AM | 0 recs
Re: No VP slot.

He could still pick her as his running mate, but it would probably be more profitable to tie a boat anchor around his neck.

by fwiffo3 2008-06-03 07:49AM | 0 recs
Re: No VP slot.

Read your comment, then think about it a minute. You are the reason the party is divided, and you clearly don't give a damn. Why should I.

by phoenixdreamz 2008-06-03 08:20AM | 0 recs
Re: No VP slot.

Because clearly, Barack Obama is responsible for random commenters on a political blog.

by fwiffo3 2008-06-03 08:33AM | 0 recs
Can I get an...

AMEN!

by SpanishFly 2008-06-03 07:38AM | 0 recs
That's a BIG NO!

by CoyoteCreek 2008-06-03 07:49AM | 0 recs
Awe, come on!

OK, how about...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D09DCZryG 2U

Hallelujah!!!!

PS.  I'll believe it when I she her say it tonight, not before.

by SpanishFly 2008-06-03 07:54AM | 0 recs
We'll have to just wait for tonight

Her aides have denied the report.

by Blazers Edge 2008-06-03 07:38AM | 0 recs
Re: We'll have to just wait for tonight

That doesn't mean anything.  It's always the position of a campaign that you're going all the way to the convention, right up until the point where you don't.

I mean, I'll believe it when I see it, but I have never in my life heard a campaign aide go on record and say "yes it's true, we're ending this... tomorrow."  They're in it until they're not.

by Jess81 2008-06-03 07:40AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Did Edwards ever formally end his campaign, by the way?  

by politicsmatters 2008-06-03 07:38AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

I Don't think so, it is still suspended.

by parahammer 2008-06-03 07:39AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

I think when you endorse another candidate, you've formally ended your campaign.

by Jess81 2008-06-03 07:41AM | 0 recs
Edwards officially ended his campaign

Edwards officially ended his campaign, thus freeing his delegates. Where were you? Didn't you see the controversy for those 16 delegates that finaly got released to go wherever>?

by alectimmerman 2008-06-03 07:57AM | 0 recs
Re: Edwards officially ended his campaign

So he did that when he endorsed Obama? Huh. I watched the event live but never heard him explicitly say that.

Still, that was a long time of a suspended campaign, you must admit.

by politicsmatters 2008-06-03 08:01AM | 0 recs
Re: Edwards officially ended his campaign

He may not have said it in the speech but the next day it started to trickle out.

And yes that was a very long suspension for a campaign.

by JDF 2008-06-03 08:18AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

This speech should be a really interesting example of verbal jujitsu. Lets see how she can concede to the reality of the situation without formally conceding the nomination.

by wasder 2008-06-03 07:38AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

She will tacitly admit that Obama currently has the delegates needed to win the nomination.  She will then remind her rabid supporters that the supers can change their minds before the convention.  She will also remind the dead-enders that no one will win the nomination until the vote at the convention.  

The Clinton dead-enders here and elsewhere have been saying these things for weeks.  They are just repeating what the Clinton campaign told them to say.  

by Blue Neponset 2008-06-03 07:44AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

If she does that, we can pretty much rule out her campaigning for Obama or otherwise supporting him.

by Firewall 2008-06-03 07:46AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

When it is in her best interests to support him she will.  Until then she will leave as many options open as possible.  

As long as she keeps taking baby steps toward endorsing Obama the supers won't have the backbone to force her hand.    

by Blue Neponset 2008-06-03 08:10AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

The supers will have given Obama enough tonight or at the latest, tomorrow.

by politicsmatters 2008-06-03 08:41AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Yeah, this would be a very unfortunate way for the GE to begin. I hope she has more class than this. I think she will acknowledge that Obama has the requisite number of delegates and leave it at that, without explaining what she will do with her delegates or whether she will endorse. Then the two of them (Obama and Clinton) will get together face to face by the end of the week and hammer out a plan for working together in whatever capacity they decide. This is the only reasonable solution.

by wasder 2008-06-03 07:58AM | 0 recs
The leak was....

Howard Wolfson?  I suppose it's possible that Ickes and Terry M. have gotten different signals.

by Blazers Edge 2008-06-03 07:39AM | 0 recs
Re: The leak was....

The Clinton campaign has been working at cross purposes since day one. That's what happens when her campaign manager McAuliffe lost every election as DNC Chair and her chief strategist Penn didn't even know the rules Democratic primaries and caucuses were conducted under.

And between them they've probably been paid $50M for it.

by Freespeechzone 2008-06-03 08:01AM | 0 recs
Not so fast

From cnn.com:


Terry McAuliffe rejected as "100 percent incorrect" media reports that Clinton is preparing to concede the race Tuesday night as the five-month Democratic primary process comes to a close.

by Sumo Vita 2008-06-03 07:40AM | 0 recs
Re: Not so fast

DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING!

Just saying.  What is he going to say?

by Jess81 2008-06-03 07:42AM | 0 recs
Hillary turning blue

Hillary can hold her breath until she turns blue, and Obama still won't be manipulated by her. He will hold to his principles and go forward with this historic change in politics.

by ImpeachBushCheney 2008-06-03 07:41AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary turning blue

what are his principles ?

by lori 2008-06-03 07:43AM | 0 recs
Your guess is as good as mine!

Maybe....he doesn't have any!!

by CoyoteCreek 2008-06-03 08:07AM | 0 recs
GBRS!!!!

Go.
Back.
To.
Redstate.

tyvm

by JDF 2008-06-03 08:15AM | 0 recs
Go..

Cheney  yourself.

by CoyoteCreek 2008-06-03 08:19AM | 0 recs
Re: Go..

thats cute...

I can think of a few things I would like you to do to yourself as well.

But do us all a favor and do them somewhere else.

Bye now

by JDF 2008-06-03 08:26AM | 0 recs
Based on what he has worked for in the past...

including the legislation he has authored and shepherded through congress, I would list things like:

Upholding the Consitution
Campaign finance reform
Government transparency and accountability
Grass roots political involvment

I base that not on what he 'says' he will do, but on what he has actually done (i.e. the 'google for government' bill).  For all the talk that Obama doesn't have experience, the truth is he has packed a lot of accomplishment into his admittedly shorter career, certainly enough to get a good idea what the guy stands for.  Based on what I've seen, I will enthusiastically vote for him in November.

by protothad 2008-06-03 08:28AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary turning blue

Barack will not do anything to get elected, like cave into Hillarys demands for power (VP) just to unite the party. He will win or lose by holding to high ideals like not having lobbyists run his campaign and refusing to accept contributions from Washington lobbyists and political action committees. I think he will win because I believe there are enough good people, (Republicans, Democrats, Independents) to be found who will support change. Many of the Hillary supporters aren't going to be part of this historic grass roots change. They will be replaced by new voters who have been turned off by the party machines.

"I did not run for the presidency to fulfill some long-held ambition or because I believed it was somehow owed to me. I chose to run in this election - at this moment - because of what Dr. King called "the fierce urgency of now." Because we are at a defining moment in our history. Our nation is at war. Our planet is in peril. Our health care system is broken, our economy is out of balance, our education system fails too many of our children, and our retirement system is in tatters." -Barack Obama, Dec. 27, 2007

Your attempts to crush hope with Clinton campaign talking points has failed.

by ImpeachBushCheney 2008-06-03 08:39AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary turning blue

Utter nonsense!  If Obama is as smart as I believe him to be, he will do what it takes to get elected.  As it is vitally important, and in his self-interest to work with Senator Clinton and thereby bring her large base of supporters onboard, you can safely bet that is exactly what he will do.    

Politics, unless you are G.W. Bush, is the art of the practical.  Once the nomination is in hand, Obama will do a lot of fence-mending with the Clintons.  Just sit back, take a deep breath, and get used to the idea.  

by BillCat 2008-06-03 07:59AM | 0 recs
They will work together

As much as supporters often like to view our candidates in stark moral contrasts, the truth is they are both career politicians with similar agendas and a wide pragmatic streak.  They will work together.  Its what congresspeople do.

As heated as this primary got at times, you have to remember that is how this game is played.  Not every voter makes their decision based on issues and facts, so candidates make emotional appeals.  That does not mean they've drank their own koolaid and feel as strongly about their opponent as their most rabid supporters do.

by protothad 2008-06-03 08:39AM | 0 recs
Re: They will work together

Glad to see that someone else understands the practical side of politics.  Even Senators Kennedy and Hatch, whose views could not be much further apart, often find reasons to work to a common goal.

by BillCat 2008-06-03 09:23AM | 0 recs
swan song

endgame

by wellinformed 2008-06-03 07:41AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Yes she is, not she's not, maybe, maybe not. I think I'll just wait to hear Senator Clinton's actual words.

by jsfox 2008-06-03 07:43AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Agreed.... until I hear it from her own lips, I will take any report with a huge block of salt.

by JenKinFLA 2008-06-03 07:54AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Per the aide, Ickes told the Democratic member yesterday: "It's over and the end will be gracious, beginning with HRC's comments at Baruch College tonight. This will be over by Thursday at the latest. There's a large Obama fundraiser in NYC on Wednesday night that will include a bunch of bigtime HRC donors (I bet he raises $300K if not more) followed by a DNC event where big bucks will also be raised. We're guessing HRC will at least appear at the DNC event with Obama and use that platform to being to unify the party. (Ickes) agrees...that HRC has more leverage between now and Thursday than after."

That's from MSNBC.  I don't care if she ends the race today or Thursday as long as she takes that approach.  BEAT MCCAIN!

by thezzyzx 2008-06-03 07:44AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Josh are you going to apologize for your post on the RFK thing about Clinton .

I thought you said you were done with her , if that was the case , one wonders why you would go and cover her event.

it seems contradictory.

by lori 2008-06-03 07:46AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

I thought his piece on RFK was complete nonsense also but then again, I suppose his role is to be to Clinton supporters what Jerome is to the Obama folks here.  The guy provides a good balance for this blog, one of the best remaining in the community.

Wouldn't you want to go to the event even if you weren't a Clinton supporter?

by Blazers Edge 2008-06-03 07:57AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

"Wouldn't you want to go to the event even if you weren't a Clinton supporter?"

Yes.

by SpanishFly 2008-06-03 08:02AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

That post was one of the most ridiculous ones I had seen in a long time in over a year I have been on this blog.

It was really upsetting.

I don't make it a practice to demand apologies but that post was over the top.

The arrogance was surprising.

by lori 2008-06-03 08:06AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Yeah, Orton seems to be one of those types that automatically imputes the most nefarious of motives to Clinton; that said, it's not as if Jerome doesn't give Obama folks a lot to get riled up about.  It's a good contrast, we all have our own whipping boys on this blog.

by Blazers Edge 2008-06-03 08:08AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

I agreed at the time that Hillary didn't mean she wanted bad things to happen to Obama but I did think she was careless with her words.  After everything else she'd said and done, she wasn't really due the benefit of the doubt, IMO.

That said, Josh's post was fine with me.  He was just expressing the frustration many of us have felt for a while now.  And, as many have pointed out, it was NOTHING compared to the daily barrage we Obama supporters took from Jerome.

Power to the People, Josh!

by SpanishFly 2008-06-03 08:13AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

I'm not sure how that's contradictory.  He said he was "done with her" in the context of being receptive to her arguments.  That has nothign to do with covering the news of the day as a blogger.  

Also, is it perhaps time for both sides to stop demanding "apologies" from the other side?  Relitigating perceived wrongs - and I include my side in that equation with equal force - really doesn't accomplish much.  As Senator Clinton herself has stated many times, and differences between her and Senator Obama pale in comparison to the differences between either democrat and John McCain.  Her words, not mine.    

by HSTruman 2008-06-03 07:57AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Right - I'm attending in my capacity as a blogger, not as a supporter. Just because I lost patience with her campaign doesn't mean I'm going to pretend she doesn't exist.

by Josh Orton 2008-06-03 08:00AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

If i had written the post you wrote on the RFK thing I don't think I would be going to her event as a blogger , much of what you wrote on the rfk thing wasn't credible. I suppose you might want to write up a post on this blog later on ,Needless to say I would think many of her supporters would have a healthy dose of skepticism on whatever you blog about her because of your post on the RFK thing.

One woman's opinion.

by lori 2008-06-03 08:14AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

What wasn't credible? Remember, my point was that her intent was irrelevant.

by Josh Orton 2008-06-03 08:25AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As

I assume that a large number of superdelegates have privately told Senator Clinton that they will be endorsing Senator Obama.

But in Hillary's world admitting that Obama "has secured the necessary delegates to be the nominee" is not the same as conceding that he will be the nominee - she is still hoping for the meteorite strike.

by My Ob 2008-06-03 07:47AM | 0 recs
Time to celebrate?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQJexFOxo lI

We'll see what she says tonight.

Tequila!!!

by SpanishFly 2008-06-03 07:48AM | 0 recs
by username 2008-06-03 07:49AM | 0 recs
Wow, another Rover!

Almost all of Rove's analyse has historically been far, far off. We Dems do have to thank him heartilly. What a moron. I'd call him Bush's ass, but that would be less of an insult than Bush's Brain.

Let's see, he barely/actually didn't beat a pre-oscar cardboard cutout in 2000
He predicted at least 300 electoral college delegates for Bush in 2004, not even close
He assured us he had the "real" math in 2006
He is a freaking moron, unethical, and a criminal.
But, by all means, align yourself with Rove.

by alectimmerman 2008-06-03 08:03AM | 0 recs
Re: Wow, another Rover!

I guess my mocking tone didn't come through there...  I just thought absurdity of the title sort of spoke for itself: "Associated Press full of it, Karl Rove right on!"  I mean really.  When you find yourself saying things like that, you're hopelessly deluded.

by username 2008-06-03 08:18AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

I haven't seen such graceless, classless, bad winners since...

...the GOP in 2000 and 2004!

How odd that it should be people supposedly inspired by messages of hope, unity, change, and an end of negative and divisive politics!

Hmmm....

by Juno 2008-06-03 07:50AM | 0 recs
umm

She hasn't conceded yet.

by parahammer 2008-06-03 07:52AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

people on the interwebs are mean to each other!  the horrors!

by Doug Tuttle 2008-06-03 07:55AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Actually, it is horrible.  

But you seem to be conceding that Obama has had zero impact on changing the tone.

I'd have to agree.

by Juno 2008-06-03 08:05AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Oh, c'mon.  You and other Clinton supporters have been abusive and condescending towards Obama supporters for months online; truly the pot calling the kettle black.

And really, I could care less.  There are about a thousand die-hard Clinton supporters on the intertubes who talk at the top of their lungs about how everything is Great! News! for! Hillary!  for weeks... you don't represent the millions who voted for her.  I don't think that being honest with you is going to keep Obama from winning this Fall.

by Lawyerish 2008-06-03 08:35AM | 0 recs
I agree with you, Juno. There are more than

a few Hillary supporters here, myself included,  who have posted diaries acknowledging Obama's win and pledging our support for him. What makes it so difficult to transition is the attitude and behavior of many of Obama's supporters here and elsewhere. Fortunately they are a minority, but there rudeness and loudness sometimes overwhelms the reasonable, welcoming Obama supporters. My advice is to simply ignore them. As this process evolves and Hillary is no longer threatening to take something away from them, their need to rage will begin to go against McCain. Besides, if Obama does what to them is unthinkable and selects Hillary as his running mate, they're going to look prettry foolish have to suddenly make nice.

by Rumarhazzit 2008-06-03 08:11AM | 0 recs
Yes, please ignore them.

Most of us Obama supporters are not Hillary Haters.  I personally have great respect for her.  It is an unfortunate side of effect of the blogosphere that it often amplifies the worst in our nature.  Those people with the most extreme position are often the most motivated to be heard.

There is also evidence that many of the worst offenders are not who they claim to be... so we should keep that in mind.

by protothad 2008-06-03 08:55AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Um... No Quarter death threats, anyone?  When people discuss things online, they tend to be dicks to each other.  It's bad enough when the subject is just technical trivia (see comp.* on usenet); when it's politics, you would expect things to be worse.

by username 2008-06-03 08:21AM | 0 recs
Month Pythons & the Black Knight

You can't both refuse to concede and argue that your opponent is a graceless winner.

Arthur was all graceful "Now stand aside worthy adversary!" but when the Black Knight kept insisting the fight was still on, Arthur had to resort to "Look you stupid bastard, you've got no arms left!".

Was Arthur being a graceless winner according to you?

by Aris Katsaris 2008-06-03 08:31AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

I think you are cherry-picking Obama supporters. I know I'm only "mean" to Clinton supporters when they deserve it. And I don't brag about Obama's victory, either.

by Covin 2008-06-03 08:37AM | 0 recs
A little more on the "tape"

Who knows whether the Michelle Obama tape exists, other than as a campaign tactic.  However, I thought this comment on Fox was interesting.  http://hotair.com/archives/2008/06/03/bo b-beckel-and-the-mighty-big-shoe/

It's on the HotAir site, so wear an asbestos raincoat and a garlic necklace.

by katmandu1 2008-06-03 07:55AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

The longer she holds out the less influence she will have, there will be an invisible line in time, between ascending influence and becoming inconsequential, she'll not want to cross and finding it will be tricky.

by notedgeways 2008-06-03 07:55AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Her potential influence peaked around the time of the Texas and Ohio primaries. That was the point where it became clear that her winning the nomination wasn't realistic (before that night, she still had an outside chance). If she had dropped out at that point, she would have been on the ticket. Even after North Carolina and Indiana, she had a chance at the VP slot.

Now... I just don't see it. The remaining NoQuarter/HillaryIs44 crowd have been whipped into such a frenzy that they'd consider a VP pick as an insult and just become more entrenched. On the other end, there would be so much Clinton baggage to take her on as VP; it would hurt more than help.

by fwiffo3 2008-06-03 08:21AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Unfortunately, I agree.  It sounds like, based on the comments I see here, we're going to have to win this thing without Hillary supporters support.  Sad, really.  But, Obama won and we've got to do whatever it takes, with or without them.

by SpanishFly 2008-06-03 08:24AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary to AP: "Fall back..."

I love Clinton's response to the AP article.  It's almost like a pimp slap, and then telling them to chill out.  They want her out so.. BAD.  It's so funny looking back I recall T.V pundits asking her to DROP OUT, if she didn't win Ohio and Texas.  Then Wright came along and Hillary started kicking major butt.  Just thinking if Wright would have broke back in November....

by nzubechukwu 2008-06-03 07:56AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary to AP: "Fall back..."

this is like the tenth time she has been about to drop out according to "unnamed sources".

getting kinda sick of it.

not sure why the media doesn't check with her before printing this bullshit.

by doberman pinche 2008-06-03 07:59AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary to AP: "Fall back..."

the media decide our political leaders for us now.

What Americans really should be fighting for is to get the media out of political campaigns. They are totally corrupt.

No media: no Bush.

No media: no Obama.

It's really bad.

by Juno 2008-06-03 08:03AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary to AP: "Fall back..."

I love your "subtle" attempt to turn Obama into Bush. Really classy Juno.

by JDF 2008-06-03 08:11AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary to AP: "Fall back..."

She's a troll.

by SpanishFly 2008-06-03 08:17AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary to AP: "Fall back..."

Look at the person's comment history, and you'll notice that that's basically the only thing our friend ever says.

by rfahey22 2008-06-03 08:30AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary to AP: "Fall back..."

She has something like 5 or 6 standard lines of text and she rotates them so as not to be obvious...

 Not.

by SpanishFly 2008-06-03 08:35AM | 0 recs
Phantom Rec

by chrisblask 2008-06-03 08:52AM | 0 recs
Re: Phantom Rec

Thanks for the Rec man.  Such as it is.  :^)

Be careful with calling you know who out too much though.  Trolls who pretend to be Hillary supporters are a protected class here.  

by SpanishFly 2008-06-03 09:02AM | 0 recs
Jack the consequences, bring the noise.

Always happy to take a hit for truth and justice.

More fool me, perhaps, but I yam what I yam.

-chris

by chrisblask 2008-06-03 09:34AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary to AP: "Fall back..."

Yes, it's a real concern of mine.

by Juno 2008-06-03 09:00AM | 0 recs
Re: Hillary to AP: "Fall back..."

Subtle?

Hardly. I've said many times quite directly that I see a lot of similarities between the two and how they ran campaigns.

by Juno 2008-06-03 08:31AM | 0 recs
I don't believe it.

It doesn't sound like her or her husband.

by Bush Bites 2008-06-03 07:59AM | 0 recs
Re: I don't believe it.

You a Repub or a Dem?

Hard to tell.

by Juno 2008-06-03 08:02AM | 0 recs
Re: I don't believe it.
Juno,
   I hate to say it, and I am not an Obama walks on water guy, so don't even go there, but In really, really think you are a McCain plant. Some of the things you say are just horrible.
by alectimmerman 2008-06-03 08:19AM | 0 recs
Re: I don't believe it.

So you can say I'm a McCain plant, but I can't ask if people who speak of the Clintons exactly as Republicans did throughout the 1990s are Republicans??

Hmmmm...that's rather curious.

(P.S. No, I'm not a McCain plant.  But I do call Obmans on their change/hope/inspiration crapola. I'm just not seein' it).

by Juno 2008-06-03 08:30AM | 0 recs
Re: I don't believe it.

Just cause you don't see it doesn't mean it is not there.

So, you gonna help us beat McCain in November or not? And yes, this is an Obama person reaching out to you, asking you for your help.

by Trowaman 2008-06-03 09:02AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold

Meta comment.. "officials who spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to divulge her plans"?  We see this over and over in the Bush Misadministration.. the Iraqi government.. every single Congressional race.. over and over.  People speak on condition of anonymity because they aren't supposed to talk to the media.. half the time what they say isn't any different than what was officially released, and for the other half the people they work for come out with a statement contradicting what was said.

It's filler, fluff, and useless.  I feel that whistleblowing and anonymity are for investigative journalism only.. not for political coverage which at best is just "they said, they said".  When I see that phrase, I tune out.  

by Wayward Son 2008-06-03 08:02AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out
I think the Clinton campaign is trying to step on the big story of the biggest political upset in American history.
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/thefix/20 08/06/wag_the_blog_the_biggest_upset.htm l
by politicsmatters 2008-06-03 08:03AM | 0 recs
Great call!

This IS the biggest upset ever.  I'd never actually thought of it before, because I've been so inundated with how much Hillary was "victimized".  

The fog is finally starting to clear!

by JulieinVT 2008-06-03 08:25AM | 0 recs
the biggest political upset in American history.
Indeed. Many books will be written on Obama and his campaign.
by Freespeechzone 2008-06-03 09:05AM | 0 recs
Chill out

Can't everyone just take Bill Clinton's advice a couple months ago and wait for what she says tonight?

by Blazers Edge 2008-06-03 08:05AM | 0 recs
Obsession isn't just a perfume.

"I haven't seen such graceless, classless, bad winners since..."

Obsession: the domination of one's thoughts or feelings by a persistent idea, image, desire, etc.

by Freespeechzone 2008-06-03 08:05AM | 0 recs
Re: Obsession isn't just a perfume.

It really is a relief to know that change of tone and end of division is on its way!

Do you guys even LISTEN to Obama??

by Juno 2008-06-03 08:28AM | 0 recs
Juno research conclusion - GOP Troll

I just did a look through Juno's archive.  I did not read every single comment, but opened several dozen across the 21 days of this user's involvement:

First comment; 5/13

Diaries: 0

Comments: 626 (average aprox 30/day)

Positive comments that I could find for any candidate: 0

Hit-piece comments against Obama: 100% from sample

Near-perfect one-liner track record.  Seems that the longer comments are a compilation of one-liner hit pieces.

So, anyone dispute that this user is specifically a GOP Troll?

If anyone can find a single comment saying anything nice about Senator Clinton I would review my opinion.

-chris

by chrisblask 2008-06-03 08:46AM | 0 recs
Re: Juno research conclusion - GOP Troll

I dispute it!!

Yeah, it's funny, you can't find anything nice I've said about Clinton, and yet, I've been accused here of being a "Clinton worshiper" and "so blinded by my adoration of Clinton..."

Curious.

Nope, Clinton isn't the issue for me.  I went from Richardson to Edwards to Clinton. I don't like personality politics (which is why the Obama campaign turns me off so much).

But I'm very horrified by the behavior of Obama supporters and his campaign and the press.  They negate his entire message which, for me, renders him a poor choice for nominee.

Anyhoo, also like the Bush White HOuse is to not confront what a person is saying but rather try to discredit and smear that person.  

So much for change.

by Juno 2008-06-03 08:57AM | 0 recs
Re: Juno research conclusion - GOP Troll

Btw, I have acknowledged that it's all but impossible for Obama supporters to believe that anyone could possibly not see the aura of divinity and perfection surrounding Obama and fall at his feet in idol worship, and if one does not they must therefore be a troll or a McCain operative or some such thing.

Such is the world of hope/inspiration/change and unity in Obamaland.

by Juno 2008-06-03 08:59AM | 0 recs
Re: Juno research conclusion - Troll

Juno,

I've read your comments, and have arrived at the conclusion that you are probably high-school student (or, possibly, a precocious but very neurotic middle-schooler).  Your posts display a serious lack of thought and maturity.  

All you do is try to pick fights.  Quite apart from whom you support, your ongoing can only bee seen as that of a troll.  (BTW, you don't have to be a McCain supporter to be a troll!  You just have to be non-constructive and combative, as you have clearly been.)

Your comments, taken as a group, are completely non-constructive.  You are the sort of person who embodies the least commone denominator of the blogosphere.  You just snipe, never contributing anything of worth.  

BTW, Full Disclosure - I am a Clinton supporter, but believe that Obama has the nomination sewn up.  It's time to move on.    

by BillCat 2008-06-03 09:49AM | 0 recs
Let me help.

by username 2008-06-03 09:12AM | 0 recs
Re: Punked.

Yes, yes.  What a clever prank.  They started a rumor about the end of her campaign on the day of the last two contests, possibly limiting the turnout.  Clever, clever folks indeed.

by reconad 2008-06-03 08:07AM | 0 recs
I think the fact that the story leaked

will keep it from happening. Hillary is not going to give such a statement at anytime where it can appear that someone other than her is making the decision.

She has the right to leave the race on her own terms and I wish people, including the press and her own advisors would let her do that. They really just need to keep the decision under wraps until she chooses to come forward.

by JDF 2008-06-03 08:09AM | 0 recs
Re: I think the fact that the story leaked

That's just ego though.  Ultimately, when there are no more delegates to be won, she will either have to face the math and acknowledge it, or else see her support dwindle.  
One of the big issues so-called Clinton haters have is that the Clintons actively spin their own reality.  It might be effective or even smart politics, but I like my reality on my terms.  By all accounts, she is acutely aware of the reality of the Democratic nomination, and I still believe that when she sees no more political upside to weaving her own reality, she will be able to deal with it on it's own terms.  I suppose I could be wrong; we've never seen her lose an election before, and it could well be that she doesn't know how.

If not tonight, then certainly by this week we will know for sure.

by SummertimeDissent 2008-06-03 10:10AM | 0 recs
Logistics

Could she get from NY to St Paul tonight?

by snowback 2008-06-03 08:19AM | 0 recs
"Obama media."

Is this snark?

Serious question.

by username 2008-06-03 08:21AM | 0 recs
Why deny it???

She's pathetic.  I'm sorry, I've just frikkin' had it with Queen Hillary.  UGH!

by JulieinVT 2008-06-03 08:22AM | 0 recs
Re: Why deny it???

Are you a Republican or a Democrat?

It's hard to tell.

Or, is this how Obama has inspired you?

by Juno 2008-06-03 08:27AM | 0 recs
Re: Why deny it???

I'm an Independent who supports true Progressives - particulary those that oppose invading sovereign countries.  

Unlike Clinton.

Your comments, by the way, suck ass.

by JulieinVT 2008-06-03 08:51AM | 0 recs
Re: Why deny it???

"Your comments, by the way, suck ass."

Julie,

Somehow, I cannot see you as a progressive.  True progressives try to respect the individual, which is clearly not what you are about.

Lose the bucket mouth and a lot more folks might find a bit of respect for you.

by BillCat 2008-06-03 09:56AM | 0 recs
Re: Why deny it???

Billcat - you've downrated 2 of my comments, and have determined that you are worthy of telling me how to behave, without considering what I'm responding to.  I haven't taken the time (nor will I) to see how many others' comments you're downrating.  

Meanwhile, in reviewing your recent comments, I see that you've determined that you're in a postiion to accuse another of being a "troll".

Pot-kettle-black.

Lose the arrogance.  

by JulieinVT 2008-06-03 11:11AM | 0 recs
Re: Why deny it???

So long as you use phrases like "suck ass," with regards to others, I will rate your comments poorly.  Of course, having now gone back to sample quite a number of your comments, it becomes evident that use of foul language is your modus operandi.  

That said, you exclusively employ the usual, whiney-tired, run-of-the-mill type of four-letter insult, rather than anything that might be original or noteworthy.  I suggest that you look to Shakespeare's "King Lear," Kent addressing Oswald, for some enlightenment reagarding creative use of insulting language.  See this link:  http://everything2.com/e2node/Longest%25 20insult%2520in%2520Shakespeare
Alternatively, try the Shakespearean insulter:
http://www.pangloss.com/seidel/Shaker/
"[Your] brain is as dry as the remainder biscuit after a voyage" - As You Like It.  Now that one is worth reading!

When offering insults, you could at least make the tiniest effort to be a bit original or creative!  Or would that put too much of a strain on your capacities?

In any case, as you insist on repeatedly behaving like a lout, it is puzzling that you object to receiving a lout's rating!  What else did you expect, paeans of praise?  LOL!

Given the limited choices of ratings available, the most I could give you was a "1."  You post surely did not deserve "2 - Mojo," and I chose not to give you a zero.  If you want praise, fine, by all means do something praiseworthy.  

by BillCat 2008-06-03 01:14PM | 0 recs
Re: Why deny it???

You are not worth any effort, creative or otherwise.  I don't need any rating from you either.

Troll.

I'm off to celebrate. Ta ta!

by JulieinVT 2008-06-03 01:45PM | 0 recs
"Are you a Republican or a Democrat?"

Remember, this question is from someone who said McCain was treated unfairly for his association with "Holocost" Hagee.

by Freespeechzone 2008-06-03 08:56AM | 0 recs
"Holocost"?

Is that a holodeck you can get on the cheap at Costco?

by username 2008-06-03 09:13AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

In a way, it really feels like we dodged a bullet.

However you feel, good or bad, about Hillary Clinton as a candidate or a president, her campaign team is a serious nut-house. As evidence, take a look at how badly this campaign has gone for her, in spite of running against the new kid on the block, and in spite of having the almost the whole Democratic machine behind her. Even the most ardent Hillary supporters recognize that Mark Penn is a titanic moron.

One of the biggest negatives for me about Hillary Clinton has always been the choices the Clintons make about the kind of people they surround themselves with. I hope she learns from her mistakes and surrounds herself with higher quality people in the future.

Imagine the Democratic campaign for president (and eventually, the White House itself) being run by the Penn/Ickes/McCauliffe/Wolfson axis. That's what would have happened if Obama hadn't come along to provide a credible challenge to the Clinton machine. Scary.

by fwiffo3 2008-06-03 08:29AM | 0 recs
Keystone cops

"Imagine the Democratic campaign for president (and eventually, the White House itself) being run by the Penn/Ickes/McCauliffe/Wolfson axis."

by Freespeechzone 2008-06-03 08:44AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

I'm starting to get nauseous.

by lsapadin 2008-06-03 08:29AM | 0 recs
There is no inconsistency

Of course she will not "concede". She will informally end her campaign and congratulate Obama on the nomination. They are scheduled to meet tomorrow and she will suspend her campaign later. I don't expect her to "concede" until much later.

It's all a matter of definition. We'll see tonight.

by Travis Stark 2008-06-03 08:31AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

phoneixdreams is NOT an Obama supporter

yer blues phoenix

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAvlYLCYO DU&feature=related

by nogo postal 2008-06-03 08:34AM | 0 recs
Re: ?

The Obama campaign's numbers must look bad in Montana and South dakota.  Once the pro-Obama media heard about this they ran this story about Hillary dropping out tonight in order to depress her turn out.  More Hillary bashing and abuse from the Obama campaign.

by karajan72 2008-06-03 08:34AM | 0 recs
Re: ?

Evidence?

by SpanishFly 2008-06-03 08:37AM | 0 recs
Re:

Hillary should not be expected to concede, she should not be asked to quit, she should not be forced out by the party.  This is the closest primary race in American History.  We will not know who wins until the votes are officially cast at the convention.  That's what party conventions are for: CHOOSING NOMINEES.  Hillary and Obama have 2 months before the convention in order to make their case to the super delegates to vote for them.  Even if Obama gets alot of supers, they can change their mind when they vote in August.  So, nothing is over until after the Convention.  And to force Hillary out before the convention is to divide the Democratic party for decades to come.

by karajan72 2008-06-03 08:37AM | 0 recs
Re: Your comment

Firstly, I am a Clinton supporter.

That said, there is no longer any credible path to the Democratic nomination for HRC.  Yes, it is close, but Obama's lead is insurmontable, IMHO.  No point in delaying the inevitable, nor is there any point in the Democratic party wasting time, money, effort or creating any further ill-will by prolonging this.  

Barring disaster, Obama will be the nominee. The superdelegates will, by and large, support the outcome of the primary process.  For the superdelgates to overthrow the results of the primary process would, in your own words, would truly "divide the Democratic party for decades to come."

Time to move on. Hillary should be expected to concede soon, or to announce suspension of her campaign.  In politics, that's what is done when the outcome is obvious.  As her supporter, I expect her to do the customary thing - indeed, I would be disappointed if she does not.  

Party conventions used to be for "choosing nominees," back in the days of the smoke-filled rooms.  These days, most of the coice is left to the voters, and it is a serious improvement.  While it is still possible that a convention might be called upon to make a choice, conventions have become much more about formalizing a choice that we voters have already made.  

by BillCat 2008-06-03 10:14AM | 0 recs
The AP story

is suspect.  I wondered if this was a leak from the Obama camp to suppress voter turnout today.  

by JustJennifer 2008-06-03 08:39AM | 0 recs
Re: The AP story

Probably.

by Al Depansu 2008-06-03 08:43AM | 0 recs
Re: The AP story

Why would that have any impact on the way the nomination fight will play out?

Clinton needs 200.5 delegates to get the nomination now.

Obama? 35.5

by politicsmatters 2008-06-03 08:44AM | 0 recs
Re: The AP story

With currently 35.5 the 16 or 17 he'll get in MT and SD would mean he's need just 18 or 19 to clinch.

With the MT supers who said they will support him and the 5 named House members coming out later today, he's almost there.

Oh, and how many supers did Clinton get today? NONE.

by politicsmatters 2008-06-03 08:48AM | 0 recs
update

Obama's current magic number is 34.5
http://demconwatch.blogspot.com/

Clinton is still at 200.5

by politicsmatters 2008-06-03 08:51AM | 0 recs
Re: The AP story

It's not enough that he wins.  Obamans want to make sure Clinton is humiliated and left bruised and bleeding.  

They've joined the GOP in that way.  I suppose that is one form of unity.

by Juno 2008-06-03 08:51AM | 0 recs
Oh bullshit

Don't you belong at Taylor Marsh and Hillaryis44?  Time to trot back over there, doncha think?

by JulieinVT 2008-06-03 08:55AM | 0 recs
Don't you belong at Taylor Marsh and Hillaryis44?

Actually, Bush/McCain.org

by Freespeechzone 2008-06-03 09:09AM | 0 recs
Re: Don't you belong at Taylor Marsh and Hillaryis

Seems I've hit some nerves.

'Ain't about me, but if you want to make it about me to distract, have at it.

But I thought Obama was opposed to that sort of thing.

Hmmmm....

by Juno 2008-06-03 09:21AM | 0 recs
Re: Oh bullshit

Nah.

What is it with Obamans thinking there must be like-think - of course being only favorable thouhts about Obama - everywhere?

Loyalty oaths next, per chance?

by Juno 2008-06-03 09:17AM | 0 recs
Re: Oh bullshit

lol...it's called "groupthink" and was previously attributed to Bushbots.  The Hillfan(atic)s have since taken over.

(PS - I was for Richardson, but didn't choose to take my toys and go home just because he lost.)

by JulieinVT 2008-06-03 09:47AM | 0 recs
Re: Oh bullshit

I was too.  Neither did I.

Went to Edwards. Then to Clinton.

None of their supporters made it hard to get behind the candidate.

No so with Obamans.  

It's very unfortunate.

by Juno 2008-06-03 09:57AM | 0 recs
Re: Oh bullshit

It should NEVER be about how a candidate's supporters are perceived by you, it should be about the country - and ending the rightwing stranglehold.

Wouldn't you agree?

by JulieinVT 2008-06-03 10:44AM | 0 recs
Re: The AP story

I think that's out of line.  With all due respect, Obama and has people have been more than differential to Hillary over recent weeks and throughout the campaign. There has been none of the character assassination that we have come to expect from the GOP and didn't even touch the old scandals from Bill's Administration.  To say otherwise is to be detached from reality.

by jbentley4 2008-06-03 10:06AM | 0 recs
I wondered if this was a leak

by Freespeechzone 2008-06-03 08:51AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

"The Obama campaign's numbers must look bad in Montana and South dakota."

Straight up bet karajan..

If Obama does not win both MT and SD by double
digits..I will not post here for a week..
If Sen. Obama does win BOTH by double digits..You agree to not post for a week.

You on?

by nogo postal 2008-06-03 08:53AM | 0 recs
Can we all agree not to feed Juno?

This is a comment posted downthread.  I welcome anyone at all to point to a single example of Juno supporting any Democrat.

Juno research conclusion - GOP Troll

I just did a look through Juno's archive.  I did not read every single comment, but opened several dozen across the 21 days of this user's involvement:

First comment; 5/13

Diaries: 0

Comments: 626 (average aprox 30/day)

Positive comments that I could find for any candidate: 0

Hit-piece comments against Obama: 100% from sample

Near-perfect one-liner track record.  Seems that the longer comments are a compilation of one-liner hit pieces.

So, anyone dispute that this user is specifically a GOP Troll?

If anyone can find a single comment saying anything nice about Senator Clinton I would review my opinion.

-chris

by chrisblask 2008-06-03 08:55AM | 0 recs
Re: Can we all agree not to feed Juno?

Wait, wait!

Don't forget to call me bitter, disgruntled, and a sore loser.

A la the White House and Scott McClellan, Colin Powell, John Diliulio, etc., etc.

Hate to bum you out, but I'm a registered Democrat, have been for 25 years, am appalled by the GOP and Bush, have been vehemently against the war from the gitgo, totally support choice and gay marriage, universal health care, higher taxes for the wealthy, want an end to this corporate/fascist culture, including the horrendous corporate press...

...but I think Obama ain't all that.

So I must be a GOP troll.

Okay.  

by Juno 2008-06-03 09:15AM | 0 recs
Last comment

You have not said anything to support a Democrat, only very much to tear one down.

Actions speak louder than denials.

by chrisblask 2008-06-03 09:28AM | 0 recs
Re: Last comment

Hmmmmmmmmm...

You must have missed my posts to Clinton supporters who say they'll vote for McCain in which I tell them that it makes no sense to vote for McCain over Obama, then.

Or missed my post from just this morning where I said that the GOP should be run out of town and that  McCain should be losing to any Dem nominee by double digits.

Funny how you just happened to miss those, huh?

Carry on your Obama inspired personal smear campaign becuase someone dares criticize Obama.

by Juno 2008-06-03 09:31AM | 0 recs
sigh

OK, of the 43 comments you have posted today, 42 of them accuse Obama and all of his supporters of being like Bush, not wanting unity, or some other form of slander.

One of them says that any Democrat should be able to beat the GOP.

Not exactly a stellar record, and still to find one where you say anything good about any Dem.

So, while I do not want to instigate a FleaFilcker-era "purge", you still have yet to show any sign of supporting any Democrat.  Slamming democrats for being like the GOP hardly counts as actually supporting a democrat.

Are you able to respond with a single statement in support of a Democrat politician - not just a "yes", but actually making a positive point about a democrat - without inserting precisely the type of statement that a GOP troll would?

-chris

by chrisblask 2008-06-03 10:33AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

karajan's response..(or anyone else)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1MwKxUAY u0

by nogo postal 2008-06-03 09:43AM | 0 recs
Re: Clinton To Acknowledge Obama As Nom, Hold Out

Juno...
this ones for you...
rock on..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thDyO9SCI Iw

by nogo postal 2008-06-03 09:46AM | 0 recs

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