Might the Mountain West Not Be as Democratic as We Thought?

I have been a strong advocate for the Democratic Party's western strategy for some time, both because the Democrats performed relatively better in the region in 2004 than they did elsewhere and because the issues facing the region, like conservation and dealing with growth, might make voters in the region more amenable to Democrats than Republicans. Indeed, Democrats across the Mountain West performed well in 2006, with Democrats being elected or reelected governor in Arizona, Colorado, New Mexico, and Wyoming; Democrats picking up congressional seats in Arizona and Colrado; Democrats winning a close Senate race in Montana; and Democrats increasing their share of state legislative seats throughout the region, as well.

But for as well as the Democrats did in 2006 by those metrics, new polling indicates that the Mountain West might not be quite as ready to swing Democratic as many, including myself, had thought. Taking a look at the new survey from the Cook Political Report and RT Strategies some interesting points jump out. Among registered voters around the country, Democrats hold a striking 16-point lead -- 52 percent to 36 percent -- on the generic congressional ballot question. Breaking down that number region by region, the numbers work out as follows:

North-
east
Mid-
west
SouthWest
Total Democrats
(Incl. Leaners)
59505148
Total Republicans
(Incl. Leaners)
31344038

Interestingly, the Democrats actually perform better in the South than they do the West. Certainly the difference is within the margin of error. But at the same time, according to the poll, the only region of the country in which the Democrats do not receive a majority on the generic congressional ballot question is in the West. But the story does not end there. Taking an even deeper look into the crosstabs of the poll at the internals of the West, some very important questions come up about the potential for Democratic Party performance in the region.

PacificMountain
West
Total Democrats
(Incl. Leaners)
5640
Total Republicans
(Incl. Leaners)
3150

I must note as clearly as possible that the margin of error for these subsamples is very high, particularly for the Mountain West, which only had 78 respondents. As such, a large grain of salt must be taken before reading too much into these numbers. Still, it's worth noting that, at least according to this poll, Republicans perform their best in the Mountain West while the Democrats perform their worst in the region. These numbers, in fact, are much worse than they are for the Democrats in the South or even in the "Farm Belt" where the Democrats maintain a 42 percent to 36 percent lead (though, again, with a very high margin of error with just 76 respondents).

Certainly we should not fret too much over numbers that come with such a high margin of error. What's more, I'm not, by any means, advocating that the Democrats give up on the strategy of focusing on the Mountain West in favor of, say, going back and trying to win back the South in 2008. That said, these numbers should at least throw a splash of cold water on to those who believe that the Democrats are bound to win in the Mountain West in 2008, both because of the trend in the region and because of the party's focus there (with the Nevada caucuses and the party's 2008 convention being held in Denver), and cause folks on this side of the aisle to redouble their efforts and outreach in states across the region.

Tags: Democrats, House 2008, Mountain West, South (all tags)

Comments

47 Comments

Waste of time

    With so few respondents this survey is worthless.

by MarvToler 2007-02-23 01:45PM | 0 recs
Absolutely agree

For all we know, all 78 respondents could live in Utah or some other conservative enclave of the Mountain West.

by peaceprogress 2007-02-23 02:08PM | 0 recs
Re: Might the Mountain West

I wonder if being a Republican in the mountain west is like being a Democrat in the south - not as indicative as you would think.  Colorado has more Repubs than Dems - but we also have a dem governor, state senate, state house, and 4/7 U.S. representatives and 1/2 senators.

Part of what is going on is that there are a lot of independents here - almost a third of voters.  While most independents are more loyal to one party than the other, they (I would think) are easier to move than those registered in a party.  But I also think that there might be a cohort of Repubs who stay in their party for traditions sake, but won't vote for religious rightwing nuts.  In spite of Colorado Springs, Colorado has more of the libertarian flavor of conservativism than the religious right flavor.

I certainly don't think Democrats are guaranteed anything here.  They have an opportunity, not a lock.  And the door was opened by the Republicans' bad behavior, both here and nationally.  We can't count on that lasting forever.

by Emma Anne 2007-02-23 01:48PM | 0 recs
Re: Might the Mountain West

I think Emma Anne's on to something. I'm registered GOP but have trended independent to Democrat since my voting history began in '76. I'm trying to remember, but my recollection is Carter, Carter, Mondale, Perot, Perot, Clinton, Gore & Kerry. There may have been a vote for Anderson as independent in there but I've been surprised how many of my fellow GOoPer's have also voted independent or Democrat in the nationals.

I do tend to get more conservative in local and state elections but since the hard right decided to merge with the religious/social conservative movement in the '70's, I have not seen a Republican presidential candidate I can vote for in good conscience. Friends are constantly asking why I don't just jump over to the Democrat side and I have to explain one more time, the Democrat's have their side of the equation under control. Someone with brains and an understanding of what fiscal conservatism and social progression truly are has to keep plugging away in the GOP primaries in hopes that one day we can offer candidates on the same intellectual plane.

I haven't had anyone take a swing at me yet, just get lots of head nods and few feeble attempts to change my tune. But in my circle of friends, many of whom are GOP like me, Fox News is a joke, the Daily Show is must see and a post on Eschaton, Daily Kos and even MyDD is something that can discussed without bringing the whole group up to speed.

by CybScryb 2007-02-23 05:44PM | 0 recs
Re: Party affiliation different here

In Colorado, "affiliation" usually ends up polling as approximately 1/3 Democratic, 1/3 Republican, and 1/3 Independent/Unaffiliated.  I think that the percentage of registered independents here is much higher than the national average.  Also, it seems, anecdotally, that the percentage of people who STRONGLY identify themselves with their party of registration is lower here.

by leveller 2007-02-23 01:48PM | 0 recs
Re: Party affiliation different here

I beat you by seconds.  :-)

by Emma Anne 2007-02-23 01:49PM | 0 recs
Re: Might the

You might want to separate the Deep South from the rest of the South, too.

by jallen 2007-02-23 02:10PM | 0 recs
Re: Might the

I hear you. Unfortunately, they didn't break out numbers that way so that's not something I can figure out on this end.

by Jonathan Singer 2007-02-23 02:20PM | 0 recs
Two Words
Bill Richardson!!!
He's the ideal democrat for the region. A Richardson Presidency could solidify the west for Dems for a generation.
by KJCity520 2007-02-23 02:10PM | 0 recs
Re: Two Words

How?  I don't get his appeal.

by jallen 2007-02-23 02:43PM | 0 recs
What part?

Democrats don't outnumber Republicans in any state in the Mountain West.  Party affiliation is not strong.  In Colorado, Democrats have won in districts with nearly 2 registered Republicans for every one Democrats. (example)

You may want to compare the summed 2006 or 2004 congressional results over the entire region and see if the number is dramatically different.

by peteco 2007-02-23 02:17PM | 0 recs
Re: What part?

Colorado, in my experience, is full of contrary people (plus Colorado Springs).

I wouldn't count on anything here, but I wouldn't assume the worst either. It's just not conventionally predictable.

by jnfr 2007-02-23 05:43PM | 0 recs
Re: Might the Mountain West Not Be as Democratic a

All of what is above about affiliation is true.

But I still think attacking the Midwest is a better 2008 strategy than attacking the Mountain states--there are more electoral votes there, anyway, and a longer history of voting democratic.  If Wisconsin can be moved more solidly blue, and Missouri and Iowa are carried, then the Republicans are in serious trouble.  

by Valatan 2007-02-23 02:21PM | 0 recs
50 states

This polling suggests we can win in both the Mountain West and the South.

by joyful alternative 2007-02-23 02:26PM | 0 recs
Interesting numbers.

   Still I am convinced we can (and should) win Colorado in 2006, and challenge in Nevada.  The other states...not so much.  I'd really like to see numbers from the states on the fringe of The South.  Kentucky, Missouri, Arkansas, North Carolina, and Florida should be challenged.  There are unpopular Republicans in office in all those states (maybe not in Florida) and Democrats performed well there in 2006.  We may not win them all (or even one), but it would certainly put the Republicans on the surprise defensive in 2008.

by cilerder86 2007-02-23 02:43PM | 0 recs
Re: Interesting numbers.

Martinez isn't really that popular and our AG was barely elected. Also, Gov. Charlie "Fabulous!" Crist  is steadily losing republican support.

by nibit25 2007-02-23 03:38PM | 0 recs
Re: Interesting numbers.

Why is Crist losing support?  Is it because he is not polarizing enough for them?  Has he been playing nice with the Florida Democrats?

by Calvin Jones and the 13th Apostle 2007-02-23 03:47PM | 0 recs
Re: Interesting numbers.

He is willing to give a little on stem cell research and gay adpotion, which is enough to send alot of these Florida republicans crazy. It odesn't really help him with Democrats, however, because he still sucks on education issues.

by nibit25 2007-02-23 03:54PM | 0 recs
Re: Interesting numbers.

- sorry I meant "doesn't". I got an education under Jeb! so don't judge me.

by nibit25 2007-02-23 03:55PM | 0 recs
The Mountain West Is A Long-Term Project

Anyone who ever thought that winning the Mountain West was the key to winning 2008 just wasn't paying attention.  We could win some states there, but if we do, we will already have won the election elsewhere.  So there is nothing dramatically new here.

We have some favorable trends in the Mountain West. What we need to do there is put long-term investments into building infrastructure (50-state strategy, anyone?), because there is a significant long-term opportunity.  This opportunity is much greater than we have in the South, outside of a few "outer south" states.

Partisan breakdowns in the South can be misleading because (a) there are still some Dixiecrats registered as Dems who will never vote Dem in a federal election, (b) there are racially gerrymandered districts that reduce the bang-for-the-buck of Democratic voters at the congressional level, even while racially polarized voting makes it virtually impossible to get statewide majorities, and (c) the South is so anomalous that trying to appeal to Southern swing voters will ensure that the national Democratic Party never stands for anything at all.  This means that Southern indepedents should properly be regarded as Republicans for any sort of comparative purposes.  (Though, of course, it doesn't mean that candidates in those races should take that view.  But they should not expect the national Party to remake itself in their image, just so they can lose by 1 percent instead of five or ten.)

The true potential of the Mountain West is likely to start showing up in 2010--especially if we win the presidency and a fillibuster-proof Senate majority in 2008--and beyond.

by Paul Rosenberg 2007-02-23 02:43PM | 0 recs
Re: The Mountain West Is A Long-Term Project

Except for Colorado and Arkansas, I agree.  Oh, and unless its Edwards v. Romney.  That would be interesting, I think.

by jallen 2007-02-23 02:50PM | 0 recs
Well, Let Me Clarify

I certainly think we could win Colorado next time (NM and NV, too), but if we do, I think we'll already have won it by improving our showing elsewhere.

Ohio should really be key.  We should be in a process of squeezing the GOP out of the entire North, now that we've got them down to just one House seat in New England.  That will happen on a faster time-table than picking up the Mountain West, IMHO.

As for Arkansas, that's not the Mountain West.  Unless there's been a humongous earthquake that no one's told me about.

by Paul Rosenberg 2007-02-23 05:40PM | 0 recs
Re: Well, Let Me Clarify

You said something about the south, but then made an exception for some of the outer southern states, like Arkansas, so I guess I wasn't really disagreeing with you.  After an amazing 2006 in Arkansas, it should definitely be considered a swinger.

by jallen 2007-02-23 06:13PM | 0 recs
Re: Well, Let Me Clarify

Yeah, but Arkansas was already pretty Democratic in congressional elections. It's a swing state, but not one of the closer ones like Ohio or Wisconsin.

by Englishlefty 2007-02-24 06:08AM | 0 recs
Re: Well, Let Me Clarify

We also swept the statewide races.

by jallen 2007-02-24 09:19AM | 0 recs
Re: Well, Let Me Clarify

Yeah.

The next election will be won or lost in Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Missouri and Ohio.  

by Valatan 2007-02-24 09:34AM | 0 recs
Let's Just Hope

there's plenty of gravy in other states as well.

There damn well should be after 8 years of Bush.

by Paul Rosenberg 2007-02-24 10:25AM | 0 recs
Re: The Mountain West Is A Long-Term Project

Yup, you hit it Paul. I've lived in Montana for 14 years.  My husband is a 5th generation cattle rancher here so I can see things from the perspective of a uppity high brow hussy from back East and from my husband's conservative friends' take on things.  I spent all day yesterday in the capitol of Helena listening to some debates.  The freaky right wing religious zealots have control of the House.(Our state party is a mess.)  So the day was spent arguing about how seat belts restrict freedom and how the universities don't hire enough conservatives.  On representative referred to a Native American representative as "Chief" and the next week called somebody a "Hooligan".  This is still the Wild West.  But people are retiring here in droves and are slowly changing the demographics. SLOWLY.  Our leadership are really Eisenhower Republicans.  I had a State  Democratic Senator tell me how much he liked David Brooks.  Okay.  Get the picture.  Any of us that talk economic opportunity and fairness are radical lefties.  However, interestingly, an influential  Representative did say that if Edwards got the nod, we had a great shot at winning the state.  My  bar poll from 2004 told me the same thing.  

by Feral Cat 2007-02-23 04:21PM | 0 recs
Precisely

It takes the right combination of factors--such as an Edwards candidacy, as you mentioned--to move things forward in leaps.

Meanwhile, it takes lots of down-in-the-ditches hard work to move things along by inches.

And if you don't move things along by inches, the leaps will never come.

by Paul Rosenberg 2007-02-23 05:31PM | 0 recs
Re: Realigning Election

It looks, at this moment, like Democrats should continue to make nice gains in the Northeast, Midwest, and South.

The numbers are for a "generic congressional ballot."  A 28 point Democratic lead in the Northeast (59%-31%) would portend further big gains along the lines of the 11 seat piuckup in 2006.  Close seats like CT-4 (Shays), NY-25 (Walsh), NY-26 (Reynolds), NY-29 (Kuhl), PA-6 (Gerlach), PA-4 (English), PA-15 (Dent), Nj-7 (Ferguson), and NJ-5 (Garrett) would likely fall.  Maybe Mike Castle's health problems would lead to a retirement in DE-At Large.  Even seats like NY-13, NY-3, and NJ-3 could be vulnerable.

The Great Lakes still has a narrow 39-38 Republican edge due to gerrymanders in Ohio and Michigan.  Republican wins in OH-1 (Chabot), OH-2 (Schmidt), and OH-15 (Pryce) were minuscule.  The same was true for Peter Roskam's win in IL-6.  I could make a case with these numbers for districts like MI-7, MI-11, MI-9, IL-10, IL-11 and OH-12.

That alone is your second consecutive big win and realignment, Paul.  In addition, seats like FL-13 (ahem), FL-8, VA-2, VA-10, VA-11 and maybe a seat or two in Kentucky look inviting.

Despite the promising figures from the Pacific Coast, good pickup opportunities seem to be limited to CA-4, WA-8 and possibly WA-5 although scandal could add another California seat or two.  AZ-1 (yes, one of those Mountain seats) and the two Republican seats in Nevada are certainly at risk.

by David Kowalski 2007-02-24 01:20AM | 0 recs
Agreed, But What's Missing

are two things: (1) Any mention of the Mountain West and (2) the qualification that Southern gains are all outside the Deep South.

With those two caveats in place, your observations about '08 races, and my observations about the prospects in long-term trends mesh almost perfectly.

Of course, state lege races are another important factor here, both in and of themselves, and as a barometer for the future, both in House and statewide races.

by Paul Rosenberg 2007-02-24 09:35AM | 0 recs
the problem isn't the turf

It is the candidates.

by Bob Brigham 2007-02-23 02:46PM | 0 recs
Re: Might the Mountain West Not Be as Democratic a

States like Utah, Wyoming and Idaho likely skew the sample.  There are some extreme Republican states, but some states that are clearly in play for the Dems.

by Marylander 2007-02-23 03:54PM | 0 recs
78 Respondents?

uh....no.

by Teaser 2007-02-23 04:29PM | 0 recs
Re: Might the Mountain West Not Be as Democratic a

I never take much stock in generic congressional polls.  They are nice for sensing trends, but in order to take advantage of them you need strong candidates running strong campaigns to challenge incumbents.  We wouldn't have won Montana if we didn't have a Tester, they won't elect just any Democrat.  Which is why I'm going to shamelessly shill for Bill Richardson to be the Presidential candidate.  The only Westerner in the race, and with Vilsack out, the only governor, he has a real chance to win these states and bring coattails to the Democrats running for congress.  His moderate stances, like on gun control, are likely to play a lot better in the west than Obama, Clinton or Edwards will.  And as a Westerner, he can assure the West that their issues, like water usage, will not be overlooked by his administration.  New Mexico, Colorado, Nevada, Arizona and Montana could be in reach of the Democrats, all states lost in 2004.

by NoahPinto 2007-02-23 05:00PM | 0 recs
No Comment

New Mexico, Colorado, Nevada, Arizona and Montana could be in reach of the Democrats, all states lost in 2004.

by Paul Rosenberg 2007-02-24 09:37AM | 0 recs
Purple not Blue

Everytime the discussion turns to how well the Democats are doing in Colorado, I point out that it is a purple state, not a blue state. Statewide democratic candidates that win tend to be cautiously conservative, rather than dramatically populist (let alone progressive). The rural, small-town, exurban, and suburban West tends to be fairly conservative. Lotta Christian-right in them thar hills.

Colorado ends up purple-blue almost entirely because Denver is a very liberal Urban area and the Denver metro area is almost half the state's population. That makes Colorado more like Washington, Oregon and California, than Idaho, Montana and even Kansas for that matter.

In other words, any of these lightly populated states WITHOUT an urban center is dominated by Conservative and sometimes arch-conservative views. The liberal Urban center is the critical counterweight to the conservative rural/exurban. It makes me interested in whether Atlanta plus the black population of Georgia could provide us with a Democratic opportunity in the South.

Can the Mtn West vote Democrat?

Well, we saw that populist and libertarian values gave Tester a win in Montana and Gary Trauner an almost win in Wyoming. However Madrid's loss in the Albuquerque area shows that merely being a democrat is insufficient, you also have to be a good candidate.

Also important for this analysis, is the fact that the Rocky Mountain West doesn't really contribute a lot of voters, electoral votes or US representatives when compared with other areas, such as the Midwest or the South. As Paul Rosenberg pointed out, let's look to flipping Ohio which has a large population and solid Democratic traditions, such as Unions. (The West is lightly unionized).

by MetaData 2007-02-23 07:32PM | 0 recs
Re: Purple not Blue
50 state strategy!  Don't concede anywhere!
Sorry, its becoming a reflex.
by jallen 2007-02-23 11:47PM | 0 recs
Re: Atlanta and Burbs

Over half of Georgia's population lives in Atlanta and its suburbs, as loosely defined by the US Census Bureau, and 90% of "metro Atlanta" lives outside the city limits.

In the last Governor's election, the Democrat won just three of the 28 counties in metro Atlanta (Fulton, because of Atlanta, DeKalb, and Clayton).  The further suburbs and even some of the closer ones are 70%+ Republican at this point although they were not heavy voters.

Traditional Georgia, the Georgia of MLK and Jimmy Carter is a tightly balanced "state."  The newer burbs are not.  So, in the short term, Democratic chances in Georgia as a whole do not look good.

by David Kowalski 2007-02-24 01:33AM | 0 recs
stick with Howard. He knows best.

Stick with Howard Deans 50 State Strategy. It works. The democratic party will continue to gain ground.

by Steambomb 2007-02-23 09:07PM | 0 recs
Re: Might the Mountain West Thought?

This all Depends on Who the candidate is for President. Though I don't like Richardson if he is nominated he probally throws the Sw and mtn west into play.

by orin76 2007-02-24 06:17AM | 0 recs
Re: Might the Mountain West Not Be as Democratic a

Mountain West states are republican because of one thing: they want government out of their lives.

If you can convince them the Dems won't take away their guns and that the Repubs are obsessed with what they do behind their closed door, you'll have them.

by coolbeanes 2007-02-24 06:48AM | 0 recs
That's Absurd!

They want all sorts of goodies from the government.  But this conflicts with their cowboy independence self-image, which makes them madder than a hornet, which they take out on the "party of big government."

Guns are just something to hang their hats on, which should be obvious since "gun control" has always been handguns used on people, not long guns used for hunting.  If anyone should understand this distinction, it's rural gun-owners.  That they don't understand the distinction indicates that they don't want to understand the distinction--for reasons outlined in the first paragraph.

What Democrats need in the Mountain West is something along the lines of a long-term strategy (or set of strategies) that repositions the common-sense political orientation away from the cowboy fantasy and toward a more realist conservation/stewardship orientation.  The practical strategies toward wolf management--bringing together ranchers and environmentalist--that are now being adopted are an example of the sort of thing I have in mind.

The Mountain West will always be much more dependent on the federal government, and much more interdependent with the rest of the country than it would like to imagine itself to be.  That's understandable.  There's a powerful geo-psychology at work.  But it can mature into something more visionary and more responsible, a stance that realizes its partnership with the rest of America.

Getting to that place will require a lot more hard work and imagination from the folks who already live there, and a lot less instant solutions from outsiders.  We can help support that process, and offer suggestions along the way--as I just did above.  But there is no substitute for a genuinely homegrown vision, embodied in their own grassroots political struggles, and the fruits the bear.

by Paul Rosenberg 2007-02-24 10:03AM | 0 recs
Re: Might the Mountain West Not Be as Democratic a

A sample of 78 people for a region with 20M people has a margin of error of about 11% with 95% confidence. In other words, a 40/50 split has a 95% chance of being between 29/61 and 51/49, and can be  ANYWHERE in that range.

Take this research as a cautionary flag to do more in depth polling, but don't use it as a basis on which to make decisions.  It is certainly good practice to redouble efforts in every region, and to not be complacent.   Urgent effort should be spent in refining this data before allocating scarce resources.  

Also, analyzing regions is highly questionable. The politics of Utah are very different than the politics of Colorado, both of which are included in Mountain West.  

I'm all for good analysis - we need better than this. Who knows of any?

by camilow 2007-02-24 07:52AM | 0 recs
Re: the Mountain West

The Rocky Mountain eight is a pretty diverse set of states, nowhere near as monolithic as, say, Dixie or New England.

Utah is pretty much a state by itself due to its overwhelming Mormon influence. Most of the other Rocky states have much LESS religious influence than the country as a whole, and to the extent they are conservative, it is a secular, libertarian conservatism, very ripe for a rift with the modern Bible-beating moralism of today's GOP. Except for Utah. And a couple of other islands like CO Springs.

Idaho and Wyoming are, together with Utah, the reddest states of them all, and the only ones that still consistently give Bush a net positive approval rating. But for different reasons than Utah. Wyoming less red than Idaho.

The other five range from getting ready to start being competitive for Democrats to already being VERY competitive for Democrats.

Montana used to be down there with ID and WY, but Schweitzer and Tester are turning that around, with some help from the immolation of Rethugs like Conrad Burns.  It's also the only one of the five presently competitive states that is not heavily influenced by a latino presence. It will be interesting to see whether the national Democratic party is willing to invest the effort needed to flip this state fully to our side. It might not look worth it for the measly three electoral votes, but it seems to me they'd be making a big mistake not trying. Our status in Montana amounts to just getting our foot in the door, and we'll surely lose it again if we don't help Schweitzer press the Dem advantage.

Nevada is almost as unique as Utah, due to the influence of Vegas, which balances an Idaho-like conservatism upstate. Nevada has been a bellweather swing state for decades. Both Clinton and Scrappy Doo won it by razor thin margins twice.

Colorado, and to a lesser extent, Arizona, are purple states slowly trending blue. Both are winnable by Dems in 2008, and the national party would be mindbogglingly stupid to ignore either state. Fortunately, because of their choice for convention site, we know they're not ignoring them.

New Mexico is, it seems to me, the only Rocky State where the Democrats have a clear advantage.

by admiralnaismith 2007-02-24 08:43AM | 0 recs
Excellent Breakdown

I would only add a particular "Amen!" to the importance of putting resources into Montana.  If we can flip Montana, then Idaho and Wyoming will instantly come a good deal closer to being competitve as well.

With the GOP needing to compete there, it will further stretch its resources at a time when we'll be upping the pressure significantly elsewhere as well.

by Paul Rosenberg 2007-02-24 10:12AM | 0 recs
Re: Might the Mountain West Not Be as

Montana is not really in play for a presidental race. It's simply becoming the New South Dakota. i.e. the Democrats control seats based on the people elected not the party.

by orin76 2007-02-24 11:15AM | 0 recs

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