Republican Disunity Growing

by Chris Bowers, Tue May 24, 2005 at 03:58:29 PM EDT

Oh baby. This is almost too much good news: Ignoring President Bush's veto threat, the House voted Tuesday to lift limits on embryonic stem cell research, a measure supporters said could accelerate cures for diseases but opponents viewed as akin to abortion.

Bush called the bill a mistake and said he would veto it. The House approved it by a 238-194 vote, far short of the two-thirds majority that would be needed to override a veto.

Here is the roll call. This is an extraordinarily rare type of vote, as the majority of Republicans actually voted against a bill that passed. This is the first time this has happened in this session of Congress.

I will be updating my Congressional Scorecards with this new information, and I will post the results tomorrow (I am not near my home computer right now). This is going to drastically change the loyalty picture, as Republican disunity on this vote was more than 50% of total Republican disunity on the ten previous votes I have counted combined.

Tags: House 2006 (all tags)

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Bush is pathetic

If this passes the Senate too, this will be the first bill Bush will veto. How sad is that? Oh well, it's good for us politically at least.

by Geotpf 2005-05-24 04:05PM | 0 recs

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If this passes the Senate...

which is where it gets really interesting. Obviously, Frist has cast his lot with the hard-line clerics who will demand he stop this from going through. Which will only accelerate the head-on train wreck he's facing with the moderates in his own caucus.

by desmoulins 2005-05-24 05:10PM | 0 recs

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Maybe

This can turn into other distraction that highlights to thegeneral public the power of the radical right in the Republican Party. The hits can just keep on coming.

by Eric11 2005-05-24 06:00PM | 0 recs

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Re: Bush is pathetic

Am I correct in thinking that this bill is open to being fillibustered? If it is, then there is no way it ever passes the Senate. Kinda ironic isn't it?

by crimsonc 2005-05-25 07:01AM | 0 recs

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I heard a report that...

...in the senate, this bill may pass with a veto-proof majority (67 votes). So, if that's even close to accurate, the other side won't have the 40 votes needed to filibuster the bill.

by Geotpf 2005-05-25 09:13AM | 0 recs

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Re: I heard a report that...

that would be remarkable and a real defeat for Bush and the religous right-wing.

by crimsonc 2005-05-25 01:56PM | 0 recs

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It's just common sense.

When the interests of the Reeps' real support base ($$$) conflicts with those of their rhetorical one (theocrats), Cash Money wins. Not one of these bad-stars wants to go work at a friggin' church when they leave public life . . .

by catastrophile 2005-05-24 04:20PM | 0 recs

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Evidence of successful dem wedge issue ???

crack in the religous - morality lock on the electorial balance ???

Sort of feels like a pop culture approach has succeded, but I take it seriously and agree with the Democratic party approach to use of stem cells.

Recalling Ron Regean's speech, Christopher Reed's passing, no single clear democratic party champion standing out front, thus seems like a pop culture leaning pulled this thru.

by leschwartz 2005-05-24 04:24PM | 0 recs

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Re: Evidence of successful dem wedge issue ???

also recent announcement of surprising progress by South Korea, showing US based research lagging behind

by leschwartz 2005-05-24 04:26PM | 0 recs

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Re: Evidence of successful dem wedge issue ???

I think that is important. Someone else was pointing how much America likes to be #1!

Show that Bush/theocon policies are letting the world pass us by in science and medicine.

Extend that beyond to showing how Bush/theocon policies are allowing the world to pass us by in science, medicine... healthcare... education... eldercare....

It hits their domestic agenda across the board and we can frame them easily with this one and still have popular support behind us on them.

by Andrew C White 2005-05-24 05:35PM | 0 recs

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Re: Evidence of successful dem wedge issue ???

I agree with you. A veto by Bush shows that he is content with allowing foreign nations to surpass us in the fields of science and medicine. Then extend that theme to other issues. It's a great political move but more importantly, it's so true.

by Eric11 2005-05-24 05:58PM | 0 recs

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Look at science and history

When science and morality clash, science eventually wins.

Look at the struggle between the British Empire and continental Europe. From the 1300s onward, Britain had the advantage, because the continentals were generally more attached to their religion than science.

The British emerged technically superior well into 20th century, when the Germans finally asserted their science above religion, and were able to challenge the British.

Asia is passing us all, because Asian cultures just don't get what the big deal with us and these clumps of cells.

by jcjcjc 2005-05-24 06:17PM | 0 recs

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GOP choosing a militarist rather than economically

strong future.. favoring the interests of the old and rich over the young (who will / do need jobs in the future)

You can't eat missiles and military technology..nomatter how profitable they are for the military-industrial complex.. (very)

But Japanese/Koreans/Chinese can and do make money from our stupidity... the future is in commerce..

Computer science majors in US (this is a new figure) are down well over 50% in US over last three years..

When asked, college kids say that people need to eat.. for example, one guys plumber dad who speaks no English is making more than his friends with CS degrees, even PhDs..

The hot field is law..

But we can't create new money with lawsuits.. merely rearrange existing..

by ultraworld 2005-05-25 04:45AM | 0 recs

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That was a little disjointed

But point taken.

As for plumbers making more than IT people, I think it's a good thing.

At the end of the day, the plumber's contribution to my survival is obvious.

by jcjcjc 2005-05-26 08:09AM | 0 recs

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Re: Evidence of successful dem wedge issue ???

Definitely played a role. It's similar to how funding for large computational clusters (used for weather modeling, physics, etc) in the US was lagging until Japan built the world's fastest computer, the Earth Simulator, two years ago.

Then, all of a sudden the purse opened up in the US 'cause we couldn't let Asia get ahead. Granted, it's getting too late in several fields of research.

by quoi 2005-05-24 10:10PM | 0 recs

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Re: Evidence of successful dem wedge issue ???

Wedge against whom? The whole reason the House GOP voted this way was to get around this as a wedge. Bush doesn't have to get elected again, so his veto can be the bogeyman that allows a lot of Republicans to vote with the mainstream (ie, pro-stem cell researach) position.

by Patton 2005-05-24 10:01PM | 0 recs

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My congressman...

Jim Oberstar (D) voted against it. I adore this man and 98% of what he stands for, but I cannot understand why he voted against this.

by Hannula 2005-05-24 04:26PM | 0 recs

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Re: My congressman...

My Representative, Diana DeGette, was a Co-Sponsor!

Which is a good thing to see, since she has been a major disappointment. But that was to be expected, since she took over Pat Schroeder's seat. But still . . .

by ck 2005-05-24 07:44PM | 0 recs

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Can you say...

Lame Duck

by Andrew C White 2005-05-24 04:51PM | 0 recs

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Re: Can you say...

I knew that you could.

by Andrew C White 2005-05-24 04:52PM | 0 recs

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There is a chance for a gift here

The gift that can be granted is
for the house to maybe be a bit
more deliberative, and careful -

That the house can be a place
where the pyrotechnics are stored
away -

That one day Men coming home from
the war, may one day have a new arm
or a leg - grown right back onto them

That Al Qaeda could do their worst,
and the boys would still come home.

Women who could not conceive may have
a new chance at fertility.

In fact, you know, the real first innovation
in all of this - if America wants to be the
originator - I'd gamble would be to
do a stem cell rebuild of the uterine
line of a woman who is still fertile,
implanted into a woman that is not.

Like Sara. She would give forth a son
after barren. Like Mary's sister.

That would be cooool. We as a society
are faced with either a careful path
to enlightment or a quick hop back into
the masturbatory practices of heat,
and light and media circus.

Didn't anyone learn that this kind of thing
doesn't sell advertising?

The house voted today to be calm, and
cool. There are certain Texans in the white
house that can be just as cool.

This is a great country we live in, on
days like this. But its a victory
for America, not for you.

America is moving on...

Counting the cars on the new jersey turnpike.
>:)

by turnerbroadcasting 2005-05-24 05:34PM | 0 recs

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verticality

Turner, what's with the narrow column thingy? Are you writing in a program that limits width, and then copy-pasting? Or is it a poetic thingy? In short posts it's okay, but in long ones, it's difficult to read and gets annoying.

[/carp]

by ck 2005-05-24 07:49PM | 0 recs

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Re: verticality

turnerbroadcasting is sort of MyDD's town drunk. Annoying, but harmless.

by quoi 2005-05-24 10:12PM | 0 recs

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Even so,

there's always that little bit of anticipation whenever I see somebody ask him about his compulsive carriage returns . . . will he answer this time?

by catastrophile 2005-05-24 11:28PM | 0 recs

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Kennedy, Bonilla . . .

Which other Republicans who want to be Senator in 2006 voted for this bill? I can't imagine that Minnesota (Kennedy) or even Texas (Bonilla) are opposed to stem cell research.

For that matter, there are plenty of Republicans who voted against who didn't win by huge margins in 2004. Wonder if their constituents really want an anti-science Congressman? I doubt this is a plus even in some of the uber-Republican districts, like Tom Price's in the north Atlanta suburbs.

by Drew 2005-05-24 06:35PM | 0 recs

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Re: Kennedy, Bonilla . . .

This vote was all about who fears Tom DeLay. Guys like Bonilla who donated money to the Defense Fund were afraid to challenge him, figuring that by keeping the vote total down, Bush would veto the legislation and it would die. But if Bush does pull out the veto pen, he'll be doing it with other legislation he does not like in the pipeline as well...like the transportation bill. Ever afraid to be the pariah, Bush might veto both and force a showdown. But if he does, he loses the ability to suffocate other Democrat bills later on. What you oppose, in terms of legislative record, is almost as important as to what you propose.

by risenmessiah 2005-05-24 08:54PM | 0 recs

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good news for when we win congress

This is great news for an entirely different reason than winning elections. There is evidence here that when we win back Congress, we may not face a unified Republican front on our issues. Think about it - the Republican caucus has stayed firm mainly because they have stuck to issues that unify them. But if we force votes on minimum wage, environmental protection, and yes, stem-cell research, we can peel off moderates and break up their coalition.

by hotshotxi 2005-05-24 06:44PM | 0 recs

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Re: good news for when we win congress

When this bill passes in the Senate and gets vetoed by Bush, it will have big implications. This, along with Social Security, shows a growing divide between Bush-Republicans and the Mods. If Bush cant unify his own party, he will be extremely unsuccessful in pushing across his agenda. It has also been said that a re-elected President really only has a year or so to get his work done... so far so good for the Dems.

by AC4508 2005-05-24 07:37PM | 0 recs

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Re: good news for when we win congress

Can you say ... squandered political capital?

by hotshotxi 2005-05-24 08:44PM | 0 recs

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the freeper response

It's kind of pleasant to see the freeper reaction:

Our Republican leadership has really let us down today.
I never thought I'd see the Republicans in the House do this.
This opens the way for the New Jersey embryo farm.

They seem to be having a contest with the Senate. Wonder who their McCain is.

Two back stabs in two days.
RINO UPRISING!

by hotshotxi 2005-05-24 06:51PM | 0 recs

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I contacted

Collin Peterson to voice my displeasure at his "Nay" vote. Probably won't do much good, but gotta try right?

by MNPundit 2005-05-24 10:10PM | 0 recs

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This was a fluke...

Not winning it but that it even came to the floor. Rep Castle horse traded his vote on the budget (IIRC) for the right to bring this to the floor.

Thats why DeLay and Hastert control things so tightly, so that bills like this do make it.

The good news is that when we retake the house we may have some Republican support on some issues.

by fwaltman 2005-05-25 09:57AM | 0 recs